Don Lemon | Lost & Found

The goal was to be on network television.

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I wanted to be Peter Jennings

or Bryant Gumbel or Max

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Robinson or one of those guys.

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I wanted to be a reporter

and then an anchor.

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That was my goal.

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Announcer: Welcome to Story and Craft.

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Now, here's your host, Marc Preston.

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Marc Preston: All right, here we go.

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Another episode of Story and Craft.

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Welcome back.

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Thank you so much for checking back in.

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Hey, if this is your first

episode, Thanks a lot.

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Appreciate you stopping by.

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Uh, going to be a great show today.

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In fact, you might hear

some snoring in a moment.

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I promise you it's not me.

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It's a ranger, our studio dog,

our little golden retriever,

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who is almost nine months old.

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Now he's under my feet.

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Uh, we're on the verge of loud

snoring, so you might hear him.

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You might not.

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Today we are sitting down

chatting with Don Lemon.

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You remember Don from CNN.

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He had a show there.

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No longer with CNN, but he's got a

YouTube show called the Don Lemon Show.

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Now Don is an author.

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He's got a few books out.

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The latest book just came

out a little while back.

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It is called, I Once Was Lost,

My Search for God in America.

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You can pick it up, uh, of course, you

know, all the online retailers, but

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as Don and I were discussing, go into

your local bookstore and pick it up.

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In fact, if we talk about any book with

any one of our guests, find a local

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bookstore, go in there and pick it up.

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Plus bookstores kind of cool to roll into

and just kind of cruise around and spend

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an afternoon with a cup of coffee now

Don't forget everything you could possibly

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want to know about story and craft all of

our guests like Don Lemon You can jump in

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there check out all of his information his

socials Just go to story and craft Pod.

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com that's story and craft pod.

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com.

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Now story and craft is on

your favorite podcast app.

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So if you could do me a favor, if

you would follow the show, uh, just

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to click and follow that way, you

get a notification every time a new

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episode comes out, also drop a star,

a little review, a little bit of

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love is always greatly appreciated.

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And as you do that, as you follow

the show and as you like it and,

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uh, leave a review, I want you

to imagine I'm reaching through.

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Your phone or whatever you're listening

on and giving you a big hug and thank you.

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I hope it didn't make that awkward.

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All right, tell you what, let's

go and jump right into it.

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Really enjoyed this

conversation with Don Lemon.

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He's got a great story to tell.

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So let's jump into it.

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Today is Don Lemon day right

here on Story and Craft.

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How are you?

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I am wonderful, and I'm, I bet it's days

like this you kind of miss having an

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engineering crew around you, but no, you

sound wonderful, my friend, so I'm kind

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of peeking out your window, seeing what

the weather is like in New York right now.

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Don Lemon: It's a little gray outside, and

it's not that, it's not usually that gray.

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Where are you?

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Marc Preston: I am located

on the southern tip of Texas,

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an island called South Padre.

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Uh, once my, once I got my youngest

daughter off to college, I was

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like, you know, it's time for the

Jimmy Buffett lifestyle, you know?

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So

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Don Lemon (2): Padre, uh, I used to,

you know, I grew up in Louisiana and

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we used to go to a down a lot to Texas.

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Marc Preston: You're originally from

Louisiana, but you're from, uh, is

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it Baton Rouge or is it new Orleans?

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So where'd you emanate from?

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Don Lemon: I'm originally from, um, a

little town called Port Allen, which

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is just west of Baton Rouge, just over

the bridge, Mississippi river bridge.

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Uh, and then we eventually

moved to East Baton Rouge.

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But my mom is still there.

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My mom moved back to Port

Allen because my dad died.

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We moved because my mom remarried.

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Marc Preston: I remember seeing your

mother on the, uh, uh, for the sake,

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oh, by the way, for the sake of full

disclosure, my kids always ask about you

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and New Year's because we would always

actually come here to vacation and you

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would, I think for at least one or two

years you were actually on I think, oh

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no, one year you were in Bourbon Street on

the Uh, at a, at a bar on Bourbon street

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for new year's with, uh, was it Brooke?

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Was that her name?

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Brooke?

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Uh, yeah.

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Um, and then the other one, y'all did

it at kind of out in the street and I

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think your mother was there for that.

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I believe for your, one of

your other new year's things.

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So, uh, but that was funny enough.

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My, my kids always made a point

of that whenever we were on

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vacation, we don't always do

that right around new year's, uh,

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Don Lemon: that new year's eve show.

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And now they kind of miss that.

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It's not there every time.

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They're like, and

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Don Lemon (2): you on new year's eve.

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I really missed it.

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That's I used to watch you.

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Well, it's, it's

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Marc Preston: nice to see people let

their hair down who are, you know,

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not able to throughout the year

because of the nature of the format,

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you know, I, but here's the thing.

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I, when I worked in radio many, many,

many years ago, I brought me there from

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Dallas is, uh, working in radio and, uh,

they had me do my very first year there.

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They had me do a show from a

balcony on Bourbon street in my,

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instead of a four hour shift, they

extended it to like seven or eight.

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It was nuts.

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So like for five days in a row,

I was on a balcony on Bourbon

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street for eight hours straight.

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So as you can tell, I still get.

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Like PTSD anytime across canal street

into the quarter, you know, so it's,

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it's a little much, you know, but

it's, it's an experience certainly.

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But, uh, but of course you had the, you

had the benefit when you were down there

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of the production crew helping you out.

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And me, the lonely radio guy

would be on the, on the balcony.

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People would be coming by like, Hey man,

let me tell you how Mardi Gras works.

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I'm like, Oh, fill me in.

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Um, So, uh, you have a great

radio voice, by the way, Marc,

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you're very, you're very kind.

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Um, does anyone ever confuse

you with another Marc Preston?

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It's funny you say that, but, uh,

only once, I think once or twice, I

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think there was an email something

or other that happened and I didn't

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know there was going to be out there.

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There was a, there was a Marc

Preston at CNN, I think, isn't there?

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Uh, okay, but he's

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Don Lemon: in the arcade and he's a friend

and I was just wondering if you guys

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ever get, you know, if they ever confuse

you or so, maybe you get emails and no,

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Marc Preston: I no longer

get messages from the club

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because my dues are past due.

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So I need to, can I pay it in that way?

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I'll hear back from everybody,

see how they're doing.

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But you said the weather's

not too terribly great.

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Now the question is, do you

miss the Louisiana weather ever?

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Do you ever kind of miss that?

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You know, take a shower, go outside,

feel like you never dried off feeling.

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Don Lemon: So I, I gotta tell you.

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I, um, was in Louisiana for Essence Fest

and I think it was July, July or August.

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I forget.

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I, you forget when you leave and then you

come back and you go, Oh, I remember this.

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Oh, not only is it like a heat wave, but

it's like a, it's like, it's a heat wave

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with a shower mist, but not cool water.

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And it is, it's oppressively hot.

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I remember thinking, Oh my gosh, I'm going

to pass out because I turned down a car to

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go to the convention center for my hotel,

because the traffic was so bad and they're

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like, you sure you want to do that?

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And I was like, yeah, you know,

it's just a couple of bucks, a

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couple of three, four blocks.

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And I got out of the hotel, I

got a block away and I said,

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why didn't I take that car?

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Because

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Marc Preston: so I took it.

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Do you see behind me?

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Yeah, you got a

construction guy out there.

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That's, hey, that's a first.

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I've never seen a construction guy come

up, uh, in somebody's building before, but

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Don Lemon: They, I think they

just hit the, they just hit

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the balcony of my building.

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And it's, I don't know if you heard that.

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So weird that you, we would be talking

about it and then all of a sudden, you

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know, they would crash into the balcony.

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So are they the

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Marc Preston: window washers

or are they doing some

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Don Lemon: pointing at

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Marc Preston: bricks?

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Okay.

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Okay.

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Well, everything.

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Okay.

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Yeah, everything's good.

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I'm good.

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Good, good, good.

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Uh, how things been going?

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Uh, you know, it's so funny.

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I told my daughter and my Emma, I told

her I was talking to, he's like, are

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you asking me anything about politics?

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It's like maybe a little bit,

but it's really about, uh, he's

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got a new book and everything.

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How many books have you written?

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I, cause I seem to

remember you had one out.

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It feels like not too long ago.

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Three goodness, three,

2011, one in 2021, 21.

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And now one in 2024 is writing

it like a cathartic experience.

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I mean, when you sit down, no, I'm going

to do a book or is it kind of like that?

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Being in school, no paper coming out.

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I

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Don Lemon: mean, you do have cathartic

moments, especially, I mean, some of the

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cathartic moments is like when it's done

and you go back and you try to edit it.

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But, um, yeah, but it, it, it's painful

because you want to write and you

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have this thing in you and you want

to say something and then you get

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into it and you're like, Oh my gosh,

maybe I don't have something to say.

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Maybe it's not enough.

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I'm not sure if this is worth writing.

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And so you go through that whole thing.

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And then once you start writing, you

just, you know, you get into a rhythm

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about it, um, and then it's over and

then you go into a process, which I

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actually think is harder Marc is that,

and that's selling the book, right?

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Because, you know, sometimes it catches

on, like, you know, you have the

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rocket ride to the top and sometimes

it's a slow build and it just depends.

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Um, but yeah, so the process

of writing it is tough.

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Marc Preston: I tell you that what would

stress me out the most is thinking,

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okay, I got two, I have so many ideas.

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I don't know which ones to kind of pick

out how to put them all together, you

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know, and that do you rely on somebody

like a good editor to go to you and

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like, okay, this is great, but, you

know, chop this out or, you know,

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what, or they're like, I don't know.

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The whole process of writing a book

would just kind of make me a little

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stressed just because of the, uh,

having too many options, I think.

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Don Lemon: Yeah.

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Well, you do, you have to have a good

editor and or a good collaborator

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that's someone that can help

you put your thoughts together.

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And I have a really great collaborator.

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Um, and this one was, this one was a

little bit harder to write than, um,

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The one before this, but it was, uh,

this is the fire, my safe, my, this

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is the fire, my search for God in

America, which was, um, kind of, uh,

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uh, a response to James Bond, James

Bond, which was kind of a response

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to James Baldwin, the fire next time.

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Uh, and I wrote it during

COVID when all the things were

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happening with George Floyd.

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And so that one I had been thinking about

for a while and wanting to do it, but

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the publishers kept saying, no one reads

those kinds of books and blah, blah, blah.

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And then George Floyd happened.

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They're like, remember that

idea you had for a book?

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Let's do it.

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It's almost like it's

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Marc Preston: like finding the right time.

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You know, I think that, you

know, you just never know the

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way that I, and I remember it.

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Well, it was, was a 21, it was a 2021.

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Uh, when, when George Floyd and all

that was going on and what, what about

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that kind of was the impetus for you

to sit down and want to write the book?

230

00:09:58,790 --> 00:10:02,700

What was that you're wanting to kind of,

you kind of want to say or comment on?

231

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Don Lemon: Well, we were all sitting

at home, Marc watching, you know,

232

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either our phones or our televisions

or computer screens or whatever it

233

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is, because we couldn't go outside.

234

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There was nothing we can do.

235

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And then these horrible images come

over our screen of a man who's,

236

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um, you know, With a police officer

kneeling on his neck until he died.

237

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And we couldn't believe it was happening.

238

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We were watching a man die in real time.

239

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And then all the protests started

happening and, you know, everyone, you

240

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know, became suddenly, you know, some

of the country who had not believed

241

00:10:31,050 --> 00:10:35,269

it became aware of, um, you know,

police brutality and excessive force.

242

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Um, and the, the talk around racism

and black lives matter really started

243

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gaining steam and people started

calling me saying, Hey, this is awful.

244

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I, you know, this is now real for me.

245

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I did not realize that this existed

because it just didn't exist for me.

246

00:10:51,864 --> 00:10:52,504

What do I do?

247

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What do I do?

248

00:10:53,044 --> 00:10:53,534

What do I do?

249

00:10:53,534 --> 00:10:54,005

What do I do?

250

00:10:54,005 --> 00:10:54,435

What do I do?

251

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Even like people who are in my

company, bosses and higher ups

252

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and people in the C suites.

253

00:10:59,085 --> 00:11:01,695

They were calling me and I told

him, and I said, you know what?

254

00:11:01,695 --> 00:11:02,485

I'm just going to write a book.

255

00:11:03,589 --> 00:11:05,060

And the book that I've

been wanting to write.

256

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And, you know, it took me

four months, which was quick.

257

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Um, and I mean, it was like from

start to finish to when it came out

258

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and it was just, it was amazing.

259

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Well, not when it came out, but it

came out in, I think in March of 2021.

260

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Don Lemon (2): Um,

261

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Don Lemon: uh, and it was, it was, that

one was a cathartic experience, but

262

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also there was a built in discipline

there because we were all in a

263

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pandemic and I would have to drive.

264

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Two hours to work in two hours from work.

265

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Really?

266

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Um, yes, because I was living,

we, uh, my partner didn't want,

267

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he's like, I can't be in the city.

268

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It was too scary.

269

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Um, for him, we're lucky enough

that we have a house that we go to

270

00:11:44,150 --> 00:11:47,610

on the weekend sometimes, and we

ended up living there for 14 months.

271

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But long story short, it

was the close proximity.

272

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The city was a ghost town.

273

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We were seeing, you know, um, mortgage,

really refrigerators, uh, morgue,

274

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morgue, refrigerators on the street,

you know, mobile morgues outside.

275

00:12:02,494 --> 00:12:04,615

And it was just too awful and depressing.

276

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So, um, it's not that

we abandoned the city.

277

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We would come in till I came into work.

278

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Uh, and we would come in and spend some

days in the city, but, uh, for the most

279

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part, we were living in Long Island.

280

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And so I would have to

drive back and forth.

281

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Someone was driving me two hours

a day, uh, four hours a day, two

282

00:12:22,444 --> 00:12:25,405

hours to work two hours back, and

that gave me the discipline because

283

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in that time I would sit and write,

284

00:12:27,244 --> 00:12:30,654

Marc Preston: I certainly help with focus,

you know, you know, sit down there and

285

00:12:30,655 --> 00:12:33,415

kind of crank it out when you actually,

I want to go a little origin story.

286

00:12:33,415 --> 00:12:34,465

We did talk a little bit about.

287

00:12:34,515 --> 00:12:38,915

being from Baton Rouge, but I'm

curious of the arc of experience that

288

00:12:38,915 --> 00:12:41,504

got you from Louisiana to New York.

289

00:12:41,584 --> 00:12:44,515

You know, the only other person I'm

thinking of, like Wynton Marsalis, you

290

00:12:44,515 --> 00:12:47,134

know, these guys that kind of came out

of New Orleans ended up in New York.

291

00:12:47,135 --> 00:12:49,635

So what was, what kind of was your path?

292

00:12:49,645 --> 00:12:53,804

Uh, I'm assuming local news figured in

there, uh, prominently, I'm assuming,

293

00:12:53,894 --> 00:12:54,164

Don Lemon: but

294

00:12:54,164 --> 00:12:55,024

Marc Preston: local, not local

295

00:12:55,024 --> 00:12:56,124

Don Lemon: news in Louisiana.

296

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Um, I left Louisiana.

297

00:12:59,175 --> 00:13:00,195

Again, what should I write about?

298

00:13:00,195 --> 00:13:06,085

I left Louisiana and, uh, one, my, my

journalism professor told me, uh, I

299

00:13:06,085 --> 00:13:09,315

would never make it and there was a whole

lot of things around race, uh, racism

300

00:13:09,315 --> 00:13:12,334

there, and then I also wanted to be free.

301

00:13:12,335 --> 00:13:14,224

And so I wanted to come out and be myself.

302

00:13:14,224 --> 00:13:17,114

Cause I, you know, I just,

I couldn't in Louisiana.

303

00:13:17,114 --> 00:13:18,414

It was just the time that we were in.

304

00:13:18,885 --> 00:13:24,145

Um, and so I left to move to New York

and then I took a job eventually in

305

00:13:24,145 --> 00:13:28,735

news in New York, starting at the

bottom as a, um, trainee in the newsroom

306

00:13:28,735 --> 00:13:33,155

and then, uh, uh, a desk assistant

to the assignment editor and then,

307

00:13:33,175 --> 00:13:37,054

um, the assignment editor, a fuel

producer, satellite feeds, coordinator,

308

00:13:37,055 --> 00:13:39,775

writer, and, and, um, and so on.

309

00:13:39,795 --> 00:13:45,215

And then, so you really did come up from

the, from like, yeah, from the bottom.

310

00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:46,060

Yeah.

311

00:13:46,060 --> 00:13:48,780

And also at the time, Marc,

I was going to school.

312

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I hadn't finished at LSU.

313

00:13:50,069 --> 00:13:50,410

I left.

314

00:13:50,449 --> 00:13:54,839

I was like, okay, I'm not dealing with

this because I knew from my performance, I

315

00:13:54,839 --> 00:13:56,709

could be a judge of people's performance.

316

00:13:56,740 --> 00:13:59,849

You know, even if you're not a professor,

you want, you understand if someone's

317

00:13:59,849 --> 00:14:03,510

good on camera and they're good behind

the anchor desk, even if you're a student

318

00:14:03,510 --> 00:14:05,000

or if you're a good reporter or whatever.

319

00:14:05,250 --> 00:14:06,110

So all of that was good.

320

00:14:06,110 --> 00:14:09,079

And for some reason, my journalism

professor told me I wouldn't make it.

321

00:14:09,439 --> 00:14:14,165

And I was like, okay, I'm And I was

very aware of the competition around

322

00:14:14,165 --> 00:14:15,435

me and I was a lot better than them.

323

00:14:15,435 --> 00:14:17,035

And I said, that can only be one thing.

324

00:14:17,495 --> 00:14:19,695

Um, and there were, you know,

there were other examples of it.

325

00:14:19,695 --> 00:14:22,035

Cause I did, I mean, it's

Louisiana, it's a deep red South.

326

00:14:22,595 --> 00:14:25,035

Um, and so I got to New

York without a degree.

327

00:14:25,035 --> 00:14:28,265

I started working in the newsroom and

while I was working, I also went to school

328

00:14:28,265 --> 00:14:30,795

and finished school at the same time.

329

00:14:31,515 --> 00:14:34,785

And, uh, and then eventually

took an, and I began reporting.

330

00:14:35,045 --> 00:14:38,935

You know, very sporadically for

the station, just off and on here.

331

00:14:39,324 --> 00:14:42,364

There was a community affairs

show called the McCreary report,

332

00:14:42,755 --> 00:14:44,115

um, which is like urban affairs.

333

00:14:44,115 --> 00:14:46,334

And I started reporting,

doing some reports for them.

334

00:14:46,745 --> 00:14:49,514

And then, um, I finally got

to put a tape together because

335

00:14:49,515 --> 00:14:50,574

I was the assignment editor.

336

00:14:51,094 --> 00:14:53,525

And I, um, sent my tape out.

337

00:14:54,125 --> 00:14:58,915

I got hired by, um, a Fox station

cause I, I worked for a Fox station

338

00:14:58,915 --> 00:15:01,825

in New York and they saw me, they're

like, we want to keep it in the family.

339

00:15:01,825 --> 00:15:05,184

So I started working for a Fox station

in Birmingham, Alabama is the weekend

340

00:15:05,185 --> 00:15:11,164

anchor and a week day reporter three

days a week reporting Saturday and

341

00:15:11,165 --> 00:15:12,264

Sunday anchoring the morning show.

342

00:15:12,265 --> 00:15:13,805

And then coming back and

anchoring an evening show.

343

00:15:14,085 --> 00:15:17,765

My last semester at Brooklyn college,

I actually did it through the

344

00:15:17,765 --> 00:15:20,425

mail, uh, from Birmingham, Alabama.

345

00:15:20,800 --> 00:15:21,579

To New York.

346

00:15:21,819 --> 00:15:24,150

This is before the

internet like was a thing.

347

00:15:24,489 --> 00:15:28,060

Uh, and I actually finished my

last semester because I got a

348

00:15:28,060 --> 00:15:32,470

job before I graduated and they

were like, you're from a job.

349

00:15:32,760 --> 00:15:34,569

So, uh, I got the opportunity.

350

00:15:34,569 --> 00:15:37,029

So while I was in Birmingham,

yes, I was finishing school,

351

00:15:37,030 --> 00:15:38,540

but that wasn't the big deal.

352

00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:42,485

Um, The big deal was actually trying to

finish school in New York and, and work.

353

00:15:42,515 --> 00:15:47,445

That was more of a, um, that was

more of a, you know, stressful.

354

00:15:47,745 --> 00:15:50,474

Marc Preston: Well, it was, was

TV the destination for you always?

355

00:15:50,474 --> 00:15:52,615

Or were you thinking, you know,

maybe print, I'll get some TV.

356

00:15:52,615 --> 00:15:53,725

It was something that fired you up.

357

00:15:53,764 --> 00:15:57,044

Uh, and that's, you know, the same

thing for me when I was in radio

358

00:15:57,044 --> 00:15:58,434

and it was the strangest thing.

359

00:15:58,605 --> 00:15:59,425

You really kind of.

360

00:15:59,760 --> 00:16:02,800

Paid your dues and, and, and the

number one Marcet in America,

361

00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:03,790

that's, that's something else.

362

00:16:03,790 --> 00:16:06,340

And then you go to Birmingham and I,

I had already worked on the radio in

363

00:16:06,340 --> 00:16:09,060

Dallas and I'd gone to school at a

couple of schools with, I ended up

364

00:16:09,060 --> 00:16:10,790

at Texas tech university in Lubbock.

365

00:16:10,790 --> 00:16:14,300

So it's a whole different feeling

coming out of the major Marcets into a

366

00:16:14,300 --> 00:16:16,149

smaller, it was kind of like, Oh, okay.

367

00:16:16,500 --> 00:16:19,180

I, first thing I noticed is I did

a lot more of the work, you know,

368

00:16:19,180 --> 00:16:20,390

when you went to a smaller Marcet.

369

00:16:20,610 --> 00:16:23,970

Don Lemon: But it actually worked

out for me because, you know, the

370

00:16:23,970 --> 00:16:25,940

traineeship in the newsroom paid off.

371

00:16:26,280 --> 00:16:29,839

And it also helped me with my

courses because, you know, I would

372

00:16:29,839 --> 00:16:32,510

do, they would say, okay, let's

do, let's go to production class.

373

00:16:32,510 --> 00:16:35,829

And they would show you how to light and

they would, they would, and then writing.

374

00:16:35,829 --> 00:16:38,369

And they would say, okay, we're

going to write intros to new stories.

375

00:16:38,370 --> 00:16:41,180

And I'm like, I, this is

what I do every day at work.

376

00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:46,030

So, uh, the teacher really give us

a story and I'd write the intro and

377

00:16:46,030 --> 00:16:48,020

they'd go, wow, You're good at this.

378

00:16:49,820 --> 00:16:51,540

Marc Preston: Well, once upon

a time, just a few months ago,

379

00:16:51,540 --> 00:16:52,750

somebody told me I was not.

380

00:16:52,750 --> 00:16:53,390

So thank you.

381

00:16:56,319 --> 00:16:57,219

Take that LSU.

382

00:16:58,160 --> 00:17:02,849

Now the question is, uh, whenever I meet

somebody who's from Louisiana or from

383

00:17:02,849 --> 00:17:05,940

New Orleans, you know, But I don't know

about Baton Rouge, if it's the same,

384

00:17:05,940 --> 00:17:10,210

but when you take them out of Newark,

out of Louisiana for a while, it kind

385

00:17:10,210 --> 00:17:13,900

of feels like a fish out of water, you

know, did it, or did you feel like that?

386

00:17:13,910 --> 00:17:17,399

Or did you kind of feel like you're more

able to spread your wings when you left?

387

00:17:17,430 --> 00:17:19,039

Uh, was it intimidating?

388

00:17:19,039 --> 00:17:21,710

Was it because, you know, here

you are a Baton Rouge kid and

389

00:17:21,710 --> 00:17:22,609

you're going out that way.

390

00:17:22,909 --> 00:17:27,700

Um, or was it, was it exactly,

was it, was it exactly what you

391

00:17:27,700 --> 00:17:29,260

needed in that time in your life?

392

00:17:30,290 --> 00:17:31,270

Don Lemon: It was all of the above.

393

00:17:31,270 --> 00:17:34,450

It was, it was intimidating because

all of the kids who were there, right?

394

00:17:34,940 --> 00:17:36,150

Because I was, I was a kid then.

395

00:17:36,610 --> 00:17:39,899

Um, they were, this was

all normal for them.

396

00:17:40,170 --> 00:17:44,050

Uh, and when you don't know anything else,

I mean, that, that was, that's the way

397

00:17:44,050 --> 00:17:46,009

they grew up and lived in New York City.

398

00:17:46,010 --> 00:17:49,260

They, they went to NYU and they went

to schools on the east coast and

399

00:17:49,450 --> 00:17:54,044

everyone got a great internship and

they all, you know, You know, went

400

00:17:54,044 --> 00:17:57,435

on to progress and, and actually be

quite successful in the business.

401

00:17:57,764 --> 00:18:00,715

I did not grow up in Louisiana

within that environment.

402

00:18:00,725 --> 00:18:01,054

Right.

403

00:18:01,064 --> 00:18:04,965

I grew up sort of, not that I

wasn't, um, not that I was like poor,

404

00:18:05,334 --> 00:18:07,274

but I just sort of did not feel.

405

00:18:07,600 --> 00:18:12,520

I grew up in a place where I wasn't

sort of entitled to do, you know, what

406

00:18:12,520 --> 00:18:16,010

I'm going to do, or I didn't have like

a parent who was sort of a legacy in

407

00:18:16,010 --> 00:18:20,330

the business or my parents didn't know

someone, or I didn't have connections.

408

00:18:20,810 --> 00:18:23,780

And most of the people I

worked with had connections.

409

00:18:23,980 --> 00:18:24,990

How did you get this job?

410

00:18:25,130 --> 00:18:28,590

Well, my dad knew this person or my,

my such and such as friends, or this

411

00:18:28,590 --> 00:18:32,020

person is my neighbor, or I went

to school with their, their kid.

412

00:18:32,210 --> 00:18:34,050

And that's how they were

all getting their jobs.

413

00:18:34,090 --> 00:18:34,950

I didn't have that.

414

00:18:35,195 --> 00:18:35,415

Marc Preston: Yeah.

415

00:18:35,415 --> 00:18:39,255

Meanwhile, you're going at a really weird

hours and working at a TV station and uh,

416

00:18:39,255 --> 00:18:42,215

you know, and everybody's just going out

at night and you're going and working.

417

00:18:42,215 --> 00:18:43,154

Don Lemon: Yeah.

418

00:18:43,155 --> 00:18:46,325

So it was, uh, it was intimidating,

but it was exactly what I needed.

419

00:18:46,444 --> 00:18:47,784

Marc Preston: In your overall experience.

420

00:18:47,784 --> 00:18:51,594

It, and when you're doing like local

Marcet affiliate work, did you go, you

421

00:18:51,595 --> 00:18:55,885

know, ultimately I want to do something

network or was there, did you say, Hey,

422

00:18:55,885 --> 00:18:57,325

I want to be the lead anchor on the.

423

00:18:57,505 --> 00:18:58,625

Five and six, 10 p.

424

00:18:58,625 --> 00:18:58,715

m.

425

00:18:58,725 --> 00:18:59,425

Newscaster.

426

00:18:59,625 --> 00:19:02,385

What was the goal for you when

you were kind of cutting your

427

00:19:02,385 --> 00:19:04,185

teeth doing the thing in tv?

428

00:19:04,675 --> 00:19:08,185

Don Lemon: The goal was to

be on network television.

429

00:19:08,215 --> 00:19:11,665

I wanted to be Peter Jennings

or Bryant Gumbel or Max

430

00:19:11,665 --> 00:19:13,694

Robinson or one of those guys.

431

00:19:14,104 --> 00:19:18,115

I wanted to be at least, you know,

do something on starting locally.

432

00:19:18,115 --> 00:19:19,685

I wanted to be a local news.

433

00:19:19,965 --> 00:19:22,065

I wanted to be a reporter

and then an anchor.

434

00:19:22,325 --> 00:19:23,185

That was my goal.

435

00:19:23,865 --> 00:19:27,805

And, uh, I was determined to get

there and it was, it was scary.

436

00:19:27,805 --> 00:19:31,145

A lot of people like those jobs that I,

you know, when I was at WNYW, a lot of

437

00:19:31,145 --> 00:19:35,264

people, not a lot, some of those people

are still there and some of those people

438

00:19:35,275 --> 00:19:37,425

wanted to be on air, uh, personalities.

439

00:19:37,570 --> 00:19:42,640

And they just sort of, um, got a job

as a field producer or a producer

440

00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:46,590

or, um, whatever, not that that's

a bad thing because many of them

441

00:19:46,590 --> 00:19:49,350

became news executives and they're

very successful, but they wanted to

442

00:19:49,350 --> 00:19:50,860

have on air careers and never did.

443

00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:53,420

And I said, you know what,

I'm just, I want to be on air.

444

00:19:53,420 --> 00:19:54,509

And that's what I'm going to do.

445

00:19:54,509 --> 00:19:55,840

So I left New York City.

446

00:19:55,840 --> 00:19:59,155

I could you know, rose up, I could

have rose up the ranks at the

447

00:19:59,155 --> 00:20:02,645

station, become a producer and then

an executive producer and then made

448

00:20:02,655 --> 00:20:04,674

perhaps a news director or whatever.

449

00:20:04,675 --> 00:20:08,475

And I, and I'm sure I would have

had a good path there, but, um, I

450

00:20:08,475 --> 00:20:10,624

wanted, I did what I wanted to do.

451

00:20:10,624 --> 00:20:11,574

And I think that I did.

452

00:20:12,239 --> 00:20:13,840

Marc Preston: Some folks

want to be the 10 p.

453

00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:13,989

m.

454

00:20:13,989 --> 00:20:14,360

anchor.

455

00:20:14,389 --> 00:20:17,429

Some people want to be the network guy,

you know, everybody's got different

456

00:20:17,479 --> 00:20:18,559

path They're wanting to chart.

457

00:20:18,899 --> 00:20:23,499

So when you Kind of get into the flow

of things you got your day to day and

458

00:20:23,509 --> 00:20:27,330

here you are saying you're commuting

in to work two hours back and forth

459

00:20:29,310 --> 00:20:33,860

What about that do you, do you miss and

what don't you miss about doing, you

460

00:20:33,860 --> 00:20:37,320

know, having the, I don't want to say

pressure, but having the responsibility,

461

00:20:37,330 --> 00:20:39,060

the weight to carry a show.

462

00:20:39,360 --> 00:20:41,489

What do you miss and what don't

you miss about doing that?

463

00:20:42,209 --> 00:20:49,085

Don Lemon: Uh, well, if you had asked

me that, You know, a year ago or so,

464

00:20:49,405 --> 00:20:50,925

my answer would have been different.

465

00:20:51,355 --> 00:20:57,895

Um, you know, I miss sort of the

daily, um, nah, I take that back.

466

00:20:57,895 --> 00:20:59,595

I was going to say, I miss

the daily routine of it.

467

00:21:00,045 --> 00:21:03,994

Um, I miss the, I miss working

with such great journalists.

468

00:21:03,995 --> 00:21:06,965

So, you know, I used to have a giant

team of journalists around me and other

469

00:21:06,965 --> 00:21:10,705

reporters and other anchors who you can

bounce stories off of, or you can, you

470

00:21:10,705 --> 00:21:13,105

know, uh, something that inspires you.

471

00:21:13,534 --> 00:21:16,610

Um, And, you know, sometimes

a bit of a competition.

472

00:21:17,050 --> 00:21:18,200

And so I miss that.

473

00:21:18,840 --> 00:21:21,999

Um, but do I miss a daily

routine or the daily grind?

474

00:21:22,050 --> 00:21:22,659

No.

475

00:21:22,970 --> 00:21:26,559

Um, do I miss, you know, sort

of where the business was going?

476

00:21:27,060 --> 00:21:27,769

No.

477

00:21:28,189 --> 00:21:31,959

Um, and I, but I'm enjoying

the freedom of this.

478

00:21:31,979 --> 00:21:37,930

So, um, there are times there are

very few times where I want to be,

479

00:21:37,940 --> 00:21:39,324

if anywhere, I want to be better.

480

00:21:39,595 --> 00:21:42,905

You know, I won't say back where I

was, but maybe on a network television.

481

00:21:43,135 --> 00:21:45,185

And usually that's only

when something big happens.

482

00:21:45,245 --> 00:21:45,505

Marc Preston: Yeah.

483

00:21:45,825 --> 00:21:48,015

Don Lemon: Um, that's gotta be

like a big itch for you that

484

00:21:48,025 --> 00:21:49,025

Marc Preston: you can't scratch.

485

00:21:49,044 --> 00:21:52,305

I'm assuming, you know, when there's

something you just figure you can

486

00:21:52,305 --> 00:21:56,604

add some context or commentary to,

but you know, and going back to my

487

00:21:56,604 --> 00:21:58,785

radio days, I know when there is a.

488

00:21:59,495 --> 00:22:02,514

Either a big management change

or a programming change.

489

00:22:02,524 --> 00:22:05,875

It's just, it's, it's a

much more micro version.

490

00:22:05,925 --> 00:22:10,324

Uh, but I know that everything that kind

of transpired at CNN, of course, you

491

00:22:10,324 --> 00:22:13,514

know, they went through a tremendous

amount of flux, but one thing I'm

492

00:22:13,514 --> 00:22:16,854

curious about, if we were to, you know,

hit rewind and we somehow had a time

493

00:22:16,865 --> 00:22:20,614

machine and you were able to go back and

somebody, some like broadcast journalism

494

00:22:20,614 --> 00:22:25,974

genie said to you, okay, Don, you've got

one year or six months, whatever, make

495

00:22:25,974 --> 00:22:28,059

whatever changes you think would be.

496

00:22:28,300 --> 00:22:32,070

Best to, to move in the

direction of better journalism,

497

00:22:32,080 --> 00:22:33,710

better network, whatever.

498

00:22:34,070 --> 00:22:35,310

You're now the CEO.

499

00:22:35,379 --> 00:22:37,340

Kind of what changes do you

think would have been adequate

500

00:22:37,350 --> 00:22:39,520

or are necessary now in news?

501

00:22:39,830 --> 00:22:42,060

Don Lemon: Well, look, I'm not, and

I don't know if anybody really cares

502

00:22:42,060 --> 00:22:48,189

about my opinion, but, um, I just, and

I'm not speaking of, of CNN in general.

503

00:22:48,259 --> 00:22:49,850

I had these conversations all the time.

504

00:22:49,850 --> 00:22:54,039

And when I was there is that,

um, I felt that we had to be

505

00:22:54,039 --> 00:22:55,729

careful with false equivalency.

506

00:22:56,489 --> 00:23:00,179

And, um, you know, you'd

say one side did one thing.

507

00:23:00,179 --> 00:23:03,370

And so therefore you hadn't, that means

another, the other side did something

508

00:23:03,409 --> 00:23:06,780

equally as bad just because, and you,

or if not, you'd have to pretend that

509

00:23:06,780 --> 00:23:11,659

they did so that you could have this

sort of fake, uh, false, you know,

510

00:23:15,140 --> 00:23:17,700

Not everything is 50 50.

511

00:23:18,210 --> 00:23:20,900

Uh, sometimes one political

party or one candidate.

512

00:23:21,390 --> 00:23:24,390

Sometimes they do things that are really

bad and the other side doesn't, you

513

00:23:24,390 --> 00:23:26,280

know, and then I'm not, It must be very

514

00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:29,460

Marc Preston: frustrating when that gets

interpreted as being biased, when it's

515

00:23:29,460 --> 00:23:31,990

just You know, when it's just the truth.

516

00:23:32,130 --> 00:23:32,460

Yeah.

517

00:23:32,510 --> 00:23:36,440

Don Lemon: And so I would, that I would,

I would, uh, I would, if I were, if I

518

00:23:36,440 --> 00:23:39,130

could go back and change anything, or

if I were a news executive, I would

519

00:23:39,140 --> 00:23:43,900

try to, I would continue to try to

make people aware, or I would hope

520

00:23:43,900 --> 00:23:47,200

that my awareness of it would have

been, would have happened much sooner.

521

00:23:47,599 --> 00:23:51,690

I wouldn't think that I had to put

someone on who was an election denier

522

00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:53,590

or lying about, you know, anything.

523

00:23:53,770 --> 00:23:54,720

I wouldn't feel that.

524

00:23:55,144 --> 00:23:58,334

I'd have to put that person on

the air or give them a platform

525

00:23:58,574 --> 00:23:59,945

to spread misinformation.

526

00:24:00,185 --> 00:24:01,534

Marc Preston: I've always

been curious about this.

527

00:24:01,544 --> 00:24:06,675

When it's your show, how much

autonomy do you have, uh, to create

528

00:24:06,685 --> 00:24:07,965

the stories you want to create?

529

00:24:08,205 --> 00:24:11,664

Typically, I'm not, every situation's a

little bit different, but to create the

530

00:24:11,664 --> 00:24:14,864

stories to follow the things you want,

percentage wise, how much do you need

531

00:24:14,865 --> 00:24:17,315

to run by somebody go, is this cool?

532

00:24:17,375 --> 00:24:19,725

Or do they say, Hey,

it's your couple hours.

533

00:24:19,725 --> 00:24:20,394

Do your thing.

534

00:24:20,394 --> 00:24:20,474

And yeah,

535

00:24:20,895 --> 00:24:21,025

Don Lemon: Yeah.

536

00:24:21,025 --> 00:24:21,675

Now it's me.

537

00:24:21,675 --> 00:24:22,975

I just say, this is what I want to do.

538

00:24:22,975 --> 00:24:23,545

And that's it.

539

00:24:23,595 --> 00:24:23,875

Right.

540

00:24:24,155 --> 00:24:27,695

Uh, before I, you know, I have an

executive producer and I have people

541

00:24:27,775 --> 00:24:30,865

we sort of weigh, you know, you know,

we've been discussing things now

542

00:24:30,865 --> 00:24:33,905

I've, I've gotten like a couple of

texts where you were, well, we've been

543

00:24:33,905 --> 00:24:35,265

talking saying, do you want to do this?

544

00:24:35,474 --> 00:24:38,255

How much hurricane do you want to

do that sort of thing for our show?

545

00:24:38,255 --> 00:24:39,484

We have a live show at five o'clock.

546

00:24:40,175 --> 00:24:46,940

Um, so how much of it wasn't no one

really ever Marc told me what to say

547

00:24:47,400 --> 00:24:49,130

or that we had to cover something.

548

00:24:49,130 --> 00:24:54,180

We just knew, um, whatever was in the

zeitgeist, if there was a big story,

549

00:24:54,180 --> 00:24:59,279

like today, it would be obviously

Zelinsky, uh, is in town or was in town.

550

00:24:59,340 --> 00:25:02,830

And it was, you know, he's, he

met with, uh, the vice president.

551

00:25:03,399 --> 00:25:06,220

He also met with, uh,

the former president.

552

00:25:06,590 --> 00:25:10,790

So any person with any sort of

editorial compass with half a brain

553

00:25:10,800 --> 00:25:13,010

knows that those are the stories

that you're going to have to cover.

554

00:25:13,470 --> 00:25:16,820

Um, and then the other things that

were towards the back end of the

555

00:25:16,820 --> 00:25:20,330

newscast, we, we, we had pretty

good editorial control over.

556

00:25:20,730 --> 00:25:23,989

And so we, for us, it would, it

would just be trying to figure

557

00:25:23,989 --> 00:25:29,680

out, um, what got priority in the

limited amount of time that we had.

558

00:25:29,890 --> 00:25:34,810

So no one ever told us we had

to, uh, say anything sometimes.

559

00:25:35,295 --> 00:25:38,895

Yes, you have got to cover the debate.

560

00:25:39,215 --> 00:25:39,585

Okay.

561

00:25:39,595 --> 00:25:42,535

We're not very far off of the debate

because that's what everybody's doing.

562

00:25:42,535 --> 00:25:45,684

That's the editorial direction of the

network today, which is understandable.

563

00:25:45,684 --> 00:25:48,284

That's not, you know, pushing

someone in a certain direction

564

00:25:48,284 --> 00:25:49,645

as a debate is a big thing.

565

00:25:49,935 --> 00:25:54,095

People need to be, uh, we, we

have to inform an electorate.

566

00:25:54,114 --> 00:25:55,805

It is our duty as journalists to do that.

567

00:25:56,155 --> 00:25:58,865

But it wasn't someone saying

you must cover something and

568

00:25:58,875 --> 00:26:00,055

you must cover it in this way.

569

00:26:00,105 --> 00:26:02,785

I don't know about other

networks, but I've never had

570

00:26:02,785 --> 00:26:04,315

never been told what to say.

571

00:26:04,315 --> 00:26:04,365

Okay.

572

00:26:04,515 --> 00:26:05,175

On CNN.

573

00:26:05,695 --> 00:26:07,745

Now that was for 16 years.

574

00:26:08,115 --> 00:26:12,145

It was different the last part the

last year or so when I was there

575

00:26:12,415 --> 00:26:14,854

Marc Preston: when everything

was kind of in flux, did, do you

576

00:26:14,854 --> 00:26:18,264

feel like there was a lot of, uh,

changes for the sake of change?

577

00:26:18,345 --> 00:26:20,774

It's just a new coat of paint on

the walls or something like that.

578

00:26:21,024 --> 00:26:23,995

Or do you think there was a real

direction about where they were,

579

00:26:24,065 --> 00:26:28,035

where the past president, you know,

where he wanted to take things?

580

00:26:28,205 --> 00:26:31,095

Is that what you feel like was

going on at CNN during that time?

581

00:26:31,135 --> 00:26:33,295

Don Lemon: Well, I mean,

listen, publicly, I'm not saying

582

00:26:33,295 --> 00:26:34,625

anything out of school, right?

583

00:26:34,625 --> 00:26:36,365

This has been reported publicly.

584

00:26:36,395 --> 00:26:40,255

They have said that they wanted to move

the network in a different direction.

585

00:26:40,335 --> 00:26:42,745

They said they wanted, they

said they wanted to become,

586

00:26:42,805 --> 00:26:44,084

uh, move it to the center.

587

00:26:44,700 --> 00:26:45,090

Right.

588

00:26:45,220 --> 00:26:49,050

And so moving it to the center, if

you believe the network is left,

589

00:26:49,280 --> 00:26:50,770

that means moving it to the right.

590

00:26:50,780 --> 00:26:52,750

So they wanted to move

the network to the right.

591

00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:55,640

Um, and, um, yeah.

592

00:26:55,640 --> 00:27:00,570

And so that was, uh, I figured

that I wasn't in that plan.

593

00:27:01,019 --> 00:27:01,359

Right.

594

00:27:01,800 --> 00:27:07,880

And, um, You know that for some people

who were there, there was a concern

595

00:27:07,890 --> 00:27:12,419

about, you know, who to give a platform

to that we wouldn't at the network have

596

00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:14,910

have previously given a platform to.

597

00:27:14,910 --> 00:27:18,680

And that's like election deniers

and, um, you know, sort of

598

00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:24,585

conspiracy theorists or, you know,

you know, people who were fringe.

599

00:27:25,045 --> 00:27:29,105

Um, and, uh, so that there was

a lot of consternation among

600

00:27:29,105 --> 00:27:30,585

the journalists who were there.

601

00:27:31,215 --> 00:27:35,754

Um, and I think I think that they

felt pressure to put people on just

602

00:27:35,755 --> 00:27:38,520

for the sake of of False equivalency.

603

00:27:38,760 --> 00:27:39,030

Yeah.

604

00:27:39,040 --> 00:27:42,510

I'm not saying that that was a real

thing, but I think that was, that

605

00:27:42,510 --> 00:27:44,280

was a real pressure that people felt.

606

00:27:44,530 --> 00:27:44,810

Right.

607

00:27:45,209 --> 00:27:45,540

I

608

00:27:45,540 --> 00:27:47,639

Marc Preston: know the idea that you said

that it's too opinionated or whatever,

609

00:27:47,639 --> 00:27:51,309

but I remember when the programming

kind of shifted, I think it's when the

610

00:27:51,309 --> 00:27:55,689

original plan, I think after seven or

so on CNN was going to be some original

611

00:27:55,689 --> 00:28:01,439

programming like WK Malbell and Anthony

Bourdain and when that changed and then

612

00:28:01,449 --> 00:28:03,020

you and Cuomo were doing your thing.

613

00:28:03,795 --> 00:28:06,765

It just kind of felt like to me, they

were seeing, I was saying, okay, this

614

00:28:06,785 --> 00:28:08,645

block we're going to have commentary.

615

00:28:08,665 --> 00:28:12,185

We're going to have a little bit more

exploration of a topic or something.

616

00:28:12,205 --> 00:28:14,775

That's kind of, it kind of made sense,

but I think some people interpreted

617

00:28:14,775 --> 00:28:17,865

that as being a bias in some way.

618

00:28:17,914 --> 00:28:20,774

And I think it's just, it's just a

point of view is somebody who's taking.

619

00:28:20,775 --> 00:28:22,069

And that was, that was.

620

00:28:22,070 --> 00:28:25,610

The thing that I think is missing a

little bit, because I know my kids, you

621

00:28:25,610 --> 00:28:28,340

know, you and Cuomo, they, it's just

a time when they were in high school.

622

00:28:28,340 --> 00:28:30,589

I just, y'all kind of, you know,

I guess I was just watching it

623

00:28:30,590 --> 00:28:33,909

a lot or they, whenever, you

know, it just would be on TV.

624

00:28:33,909 --> 00:28:36,759

Uh, and I think, I think they

became fans of you after, after

625

00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:38,109

your New Year's Eve broadcast.

626

00:28:38,109 --> 00:28:41,329

I think that's, you know, it's kind of

hard not to have recognition with kids.

627

00:28:41,330 --> 00:28:42,629

Like we like this guy.

628

00:28:42,950 --> 00:28:46,420

You know, going forward, uh, now you

got the, you got your show on YouTube.

629

00:28:46,780 --> 00:28:48,220

It's still on YouTube, correct?

630

00:28:48,270 --> 00:28:49,010

On YouTube.

631

00:28:49,010 --> 00:28:49,990

It's on, um,

632

00:28:50,050 --> 00:28:53,820

Don Lemon: X it's on,

um, uh, iHeart, Spotify.

633

00:28:53,830 --> 00:28:54,070

Oh, so

634

00:28:54,430 --> 00:28:56,049

Marc Preston: you, wait, let me

get, so you actually ended up

635

00:28:56,220 --> 00:28:57,150

Don Lemon: getting on X?

636

00:28:57,260 --> 00:28:58,379

No, I posted on X.

637

00:28:58,380 --> 00:29:00,690

The original plan was,

here's the original plan.

638

00:29:00,700 --> 00:29:02,310

You're talking about

the Musk thing, right?

639

00:29:02,340 --> 00:29:03,230

Right, right, right.

640

00:29:03,260 --> 00:29:03,580

Yeah.

641

00:29:03,645 --> 00:29:07,565

The original plan was to have the

Don Lemon show and to have it run on

642

00:29:07,575 --> 00:29:09,055

anywhere that you can get your streaming.

643

00:29:09,055 --> 00:29:15,635

The only thing, the difference is that,

um, X needed and publicly courted me

644

00:29:15,635 --> 00:29:21,130

to come on to their platform to do a

content deal with them to, um, To sort

645

00:29:21,130 --> 00:29:24,130

of, uh, moderate the network, right?

646

00:29:24,130 --> 00:29:29,330

Because there's there's it was becoming

so far right extreme that they said

647

00:29:29,330 --> 00:29:32,520

we that Elon Musk said, We want

someone like you to come on because

648

00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:36,629

he deemed me to be left right to sort

of moderate to be a counter to that.

649

00:29:37,129 --> 00:29:42,110

Um, and so my deal with them was a

distribution or a content deal, and

650

00:29:42,110 --> 00:29:47,315

it was They would get some exclusive

material for a certain amount of time,

651

00:29:47,315 --> 00:29:48,785

and then it would go everywhere else.

652

00:29:49,024 --> 00:29:50,945

So it was just a content deal.

653

00:29:51,195 --> 00:29:52,585

I was not working for them.

654

00:29:52,925 --> 00:29:56,800

Um, It was, they had no

editorial control over my show.

655

00:29:57,090 --> 00:29:58,250

It's just like a distribution.

656

00:29:58,250 --> 00:30:01,940

Like, you know, Apple, our, um,

Spotify calls up and says, Hey, we

657

00:30:01,940 --> 00:30:03,420

want to run your show on our channel.

658

00:30:03,870 --> 00:30:05,610

Like, how do we work

that sort of thing out?

659

00:30:05,689 --> 00:30:06,390

It's like, okay, great.

660

00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:09,129

But you know, I'm already, you

know, I'm already on Apple music.

661

00:30:09,130 --> 00:30:09,799

That's fine.

662

00:30:09,809 --> 00:30:11,729

And then we'll do a deal with

you and blah, blah, blah.

663

00:30:11,969 --> 00:30:15,670

And then I heart says, Oh, you know, we

know you're doing a deal with Spotify

664

00:30:15,690 --> 00:30:19,330

and Apple, what do we need to do in

order to get you on our platform?

665

00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:20,920

And then same thing with X.

666

00:30:22,185 --> 00:30:24,395

We know you're going on

this platform or whatever.

667

00:30:24,535 --> 00:30:26,735

What do we need to do

to get on our platform?

668

00:30:26,975 --> 00:30:29,595

And can you give us some

exclusive material, something

669

00:30:29,595 --> 00:30:30,965

that's exclusive to us?

670

00:30:31,095 --> 00:30:31,565

Sure.

671

00:30:31,675 --> 00:30:32,704

Let's work on that deal.

672

00:30:32,715 --> 00:30:34,465

And we'll, we'll come up

with a deal to do that.

673

00:30:34,875 --> 00:30:39,584

But it wasn't the Don Lemon show

on, you know, the ex Don Lemon show.

674

00:30:39,585 --> 00:30:40,825

It was the Don Lemon show.

675

00:30:41,575 --> 00:30:44,925

X is a distribution partner and

they wanted some exclusive material

676

00:30:44,935 --> 00:30:48,625

that would eventually within 24 or

48 hours run any everywhere else.

677

00:30:48,625 --> 00:30:49,724

Kind

678

00:30:49,725 --> 00:30:51,704

Marc Preston: of like a first look

where people, you know, jump on X.

679

00:30:51,704 --> 00:30:54,005

They always get the, uh, it's

always going to be fresh on X.

680

00:30:54,185 --> 00:30:54,425

Don Lemon: Yeah.

681

00:30:54,425 --> 00:30:55,745

And you know, in radio, right?

682

00:30:55,784 --> 00:31:00,095

You, if you have a sponsor or if you

have, uh, either a business or an

683

00:31:00,105 --> 00:31:03,975

entity or whatever, uh, and they'll

say, we need some exclusive programming.

684

00:31:04,205 --> 00:31:08,115

Can you do something on the stock

Marcet sponsored by blah, blah, blah.

685

00:31:08,425 --> 00:31:10,525

For this amount of time or one day a week.

686

00:31:10,525 --> 00:31:11,885

And then you do a show for them.

687

00:31:11,885 --> 00:31:13,705

That's focused on the stock Marcet.

688

00:31:14,145 --> 00:31:15,275

Um, so that's it.

689

00:31:15,275 --> 00:31:19,774

The

690

00:31:22,455 --> 00:31:24,505

Marc Preston: thing that was

curious to me is it, here you

691

00:31:24,505 --> 00:31:25,884

are, you interviewed Elon Musk.

692

00:31:25,884 --> 00:31:28,684

And before he could even air the,

uh, you can air the interview.

693

00:31:28,695 --> 00:31:30,594

He decided to kind of

pull the plug on the idea.

694

00:31:30,975 --> 00:31:32,635

That's all I remember from that.

695

00:31:32,675 --> 00:31:34,104

Uh, I don't, I, I wasn't

really paying attention.

696

00:31:34,275 --> 00:31:37,485

I guess that week paying attention

to the news as much, but was that

697

00:31:37,485 --> 00:31:38,595

what was the impetus for that?

698

00:31:38,595 --> 00:31:41,455

It just decided that maybe we

don't want to go that direction.

699

00:31:41,455 --> 00:31:46,504

Or do you even know why he decided to

make that alteration to the programming?

700

00:31:46,735 --> 00:31:49,435

Don Lemon: I, you'd have to ask

him, I can't, I'm not in his head.

701

00:31:49,435 --> 00:31:50,335

I have no idea.

702

00:31:50,515 --> 00:31:52,444

I've honestly, you'd have to ask him.

703

00:31:52,445 --> 00:31:52,885

I don't know.

704

00:31:53,295 --> 00:31:54,965

Why he chose to do what he did.

705

00:31:55,345 --> 00:31:57,515

Marc Preston: Well, I'm, I'm

delighted you landed on your feet.

706

00:31:57,545 --> 00:32:01,264

Yeah, maybe because I'm actually, I'm

actually six miles from SpaceX where

707

00:32:01,264 --> 00:32:03,065

they launched their starship thing.

708

00:32:03,065 --> 00:32:06,085

So maybe I'll cruise over there and

go, Elon got a question for you.

709

00:32:06,655 --> 00:32:08,855

Uh, the next thing is like, who are you?

710

00:32:08,855 --> 00:32:09,804

And here's my security.

711

00:32:10,145 --> 00:32:10,955

Um, so.

712

00:32:11,610 --> 00:32:15,580

As you're going along, what were

you getting feedback from, uh,

713

00:32:15,730 --> 00:32:18,310

people, you know, your, your, your

mother, your, your family, what were,

714

00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:21,549

what were they thinking about the

trajectory of where you were going?

715

00:32:21,549 --> 00:32:23,079

Because now they're seeing you on TV.

716

00:32:23,080 --> 00:32:26,090

They're seeing your point of view, maybe

in ways they hadn't seen it before.

717

00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:28,610

What was the feedback from your family?

718

00:32:28,619 --> 00:32:31,939

Seeing you nightly, hearing

you, you know, everybody's

719

00:32:31,939 --> 00:32:33,469

family's got opinions, you know?

720

00:32:33,859 --> 00:32:37,865

Don Lemon: Um, Look, my sister

every night before my sister

721

00:32:37,865 --> 00:32:42,005

passed unexpectedly and she died

of an accidental drowning in 2018.

722

00:32:42,025 --> 00:32:42,995

She used to watch every night.

723

00:32:42,995 --> 00:32:44,725

She would actually she

had a couple of them.

724

00:32:45,184 --> 00:32:49,314

Um, uh, my it was CNN tonight

with Don Lemon T shirts.

725

00:32:50,555 --> 00:32:53,745

And, uh, so she would buy one and

she would wear it every night.

726

00:32:53,775 --> 00:32:54,125

Right.

727

00:32:54,175 --> 00:32:55,415

And she'd have to wash it or whatever.

728

00:32:55,415 --> 00:32:58,985

And then she'd wear that one out or

where the two or whatever the spares are.

729

00:32:58,985 --> 00:33:00,234

And then she'd go, I

need some more shirts.

730

00:33:00,234 --> 00:33:02,085

Cause they would, she would

like sit and watch every night.

731

00:33:02,335 --> 00:33:03,825

My mom sat and watched every night.

732

00:33:03,825 --> 00:33:05,434

My other sister sat and watch every night.

733

00:33:05,465 --> 00:33:06,905

My nieces sat and watch every night.

734

00:33:06,924 --> 00:33:08,515

My cousin sat and watched every night.

735

00:33:08,925 --> 00:33:11,915

Uh, and sometimes they agreed with

me pretty much most of the time.

736

00:33:11,975 --> 00:33:16,115

Uh, other times they didn't, but most

of them knew like, that's my job.

737

00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:22,110

My sister who, you know, is an

expert, um, hair, uh, colorist.

738

00:33:22,320 --> 00:33:24,669

I didn't come into her work and say,

you know what, you should have made

739

00:33:24,670 --> 00:33:28,100

that a little blonder or you should have

made that a little redder or whatever.

740

00:33:28,100 --> 00:33:28,990

I don't like that color.

741

00:33:29,629 --> 00:33:31,139

They knew that this is his job.

742

00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:32,620

And, um, that's it.

743

00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:35,150

My sister would just

go, Ooh, you scared me.

744

00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:37,280

Be careful because you know.

745

00:33:38,330 --> 00:33:41,230

You never know that they might,

uh, they might get mad at

746

00:33:41,230 --> 00:33:42,260

something that you're saying.

747

00:33:42,330 --> 00:33:45,780

I'm like, well, I, I said, sis,

one day that will happen and

748

00:33:45,780 --> 00:33:46,710

we'll have to deal with it.

749

00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:47,680

Marc Preston: What did your folks do?

750

00:33:47,700 --> 00:33:48,860

What was their background?

751

00:33:48,919 --> 00:33:52,160

Uh, were there, was anybody in your

family where there was media or

752

00:33:52,169 --> 00:33:53,829

journalism part of what they had going on?

753

00:33:54,210 --> 00:34:00,930

Don Lemon: My, uh, my mom was,

uh, worked at Exxon Chemicals.

754

00:34:01,110 --> 00:34:07,930

So originally my mom and my dad met,

my mom was walking to college and she

755

00:34:07,930 --> 00:34:11,939

passed a law office that said they were,

he was looking for a legal secretary.

756

00:34:12,500 --> 00:34:14,650

She applied and became his secretary.

757

00:34:16,025 --> 00:34:17,465

Eventually I became the product of that.

758

00:34:17,965 --> 00:34:20,965

And then, uh, so my real

dad was an attorney.

759

00:34:21,405 --> 00:34:24,165

And then years later, um,

I, well, my real dad died.

760

00:34:24,165 --> 00:34:27,645

And then years later, my mom

remarried and my, um, dad was a

761

00:34:27,645 --> 00:34:29,985

pipe fitter at Exxon chemicals.

762

00:34:30,155 --> 00:34:31,574

They also met at work.

763

00:34:32,334 --> 00:34:38,105

Uh, and then, so my mom was a head of

purchasing, like purchasing for the

764

00:34:38,105 --> 00:34:43,100

Chlorobutyl something, which is a rubble

rubber and pallets and all those things.

765

00:34:43,110 --> 00:34:46,220

So she was a professional

woman who had a big time title.

766

00:34:46,220 --> 00:34:47,440

And my dad was a pipe fitter.

767

00:34:47,440 --> 00:34:49,100

And then he, he was retired.

768

00:34:49,460 --> 00:34:51,049

Um, and she worked.

769

00:34:51,415 --> 00:34:55,405

And then he died and then she

retired a couple of years later,

770

00:34:55,405 --> 00:34:57,245

but that's what my parents did.

771

00:34:57,405 --> 00:35:00,115

Marc Preston: You took a path less

traveled in the, uh, lemon family.

772

00:35:00,115 --> 00:35:03,864

You know, you're not having the

hecticness of the network schedule.

773

00:35:03,864 --> 00:35:06,155

Do you, are you able to kind

of travel a little bit more?

774

00:35:06,414 --> 00:35:11,215

How has life changed for you,

uh, as well since, uh, the, the,

775

00:35:11,215 --> 00:35:13,235

um, routine of network news?

776

00:35:13,410 --> 00:35:17,800

Don Lemon: Well, you know, I, I don't

travel as much for work, obviously.

777

00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:21,320

Um, well, in a different capacity

because I still do travel and I do

778

00:35:21,320 --> 00:35:24,060

speaking engagements and, you know,

people are asking me to do things.

779

00:35:24,060 --> 00:35:24,799

I'm on a book tour.

780

00:35:24,799 --> 00:35:29,990

So I travel, but I used to travel for

work to do work stories a lot more, um,

781

00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:32,130

that were directly involved in news.

782

00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:36,090

Um, you know, with my job,

you know, you got to go to D.

783

00:35:36,090 --> 00:35:36,270

C.

784

00:35:36,270 --> 00:35:36,730

To do this.

785

00:35:36,730 --> 00:35:37,350

You got to go.

786

00:35:37,350 --> 00:35:39,420

I still do those things, but

it's in a different capacity.

787

00:35:39,420 --> 00:35:41,500

Like, you know, now, uh, when I went to D.

788

00:35:41,500 --> 00:35:41,650

C.

789

00:35:41,650 --> 00:35:46,825

I went to, you know, Um,

moderate a, uh, a talk for the

790

00:35:46,855 --> 00:35:48,295

congressional black caucus, right?

791

00:35:48,585 --> 00:35:49,545

When usually I would go to D.

792

00:35:49,545 --> 00:35:49,765

C.

793

00:35:49,795 --> 00:35:52,105

because, okay, you need to

interview senator such and such.

794

00:35:52,545 --> 00:35:53,234

So it's different.

795

00:35:53,625 --> 00:35:58,535

Um, but the routine has changed to say,

I don't wake up in the morning and go,

796

00:35:58,595 --> 00:36:02,214

you know, I gotta, I gotta tune into

the network editorial call and what

797

00:36:02,214 --> 00:36:03,525

they're doing and blah, blah, blah.

798

00:36:03,835 --> 00:36:06,525

I have my own live editorial call.

799

00:36:07,020 --> 00:36:10,360

For the, you know, whoever wants to

watch it around the world on YouTube.

800

00:36:10,870 --> 00:36:15,869

Um, it's, it's a live call because I

do a 10 AM show that I call hot topics

801

00:36:15,869 --> 00:36:19,299

where we discuss everything that's going

on and I try to get people up to date.

802

00:36:19,300 --> 00:36:20,639

So that is my morning call.

803

00:36:20,829 --> 00:36:24,670

But before that, it's just me and

my producer and my, and a writer.

804

00:36:25,345 --> 00:36:29,135

Um, and we decide like, Hey,

what do you want to put in there?

805

00:36:29,415 --> 00:36:30,835

Uh, we want to talk this morning.

806

00:36:30,835 --> 00:36:34,195

Like, like this morning I said, do you

have a, can you get a live picture on

807

00:36:34,215 --> 00:36:39,094

YouTube for, um, Netanyahu is going to

be speaking when we go live at 10 a.

808

00:36:39,094 --> 00:36:39,374

m.

809

00:36:39,844 --> 00:36:43,475

And so it's very similar on a

smaller scale of what I did.

810

00:36:43,795 --> 00:36:47,495

And so I don't have the exact sort

of routine, but if I don't want to

811

00:36:47,495 --> 00:36:48,975

do it, I just, I don't have to do it.

812

00:36:48,975 --> 00:36:50,055

I can say there's no show today.

813

00:36:50,705 --> 00:36:54,405

Or I'm traveling, I'll be on a plane

to Los Angeles and there's no show.

814

00:36:54,625 --> 00:36:57,505

You know, I'll join you when I get

to Los Angeles and I put the show on

815

00:36:57,505 --> 00:36:58,835

whenever I want to put the show on.

816

00:36:58,905 --> 00:37:00,125

Marc Preston: Do you like that freedom?

817

00:37:00,125 --> 00:37:03,595

Do you like that being able to kind

of craft it how you want to craft it?

818

00:37:03,625 --> 00:37:06,985

Because people have a means of

watching sitting in their pocket.

819

00:37:07,055 --> 00:37:09,025

It's different from when you

were coming up with what we

820

00:37:09,174 --> 00:37:10,044

thought it was going to be.

821

00:37:10,394 --> 00:37:11,124

Don Lemon: That's where it's going.

822

00:37:11,124 --> 00:37:16,164

Listen, there's still a place

for, uh, cable and, and broadcast.

823

00:37:16,384 --> 00:37:18,084

You know, there's still

a place for the networks.

824

00:37:18,084 --> 00:37:18,134

Thanks.

825

00:37:19,800 --> 00:37:24,240

More and more, I think independent media

is going to catch on more and more.

826

00:37:24,240 --> 00:37:26,670

And I think those of us, let's say

there were people who were, who got

827

00:37:26,670 --> 00:37:29,950

into this space a long before I did,

but I think there's still room now.

828

00:37:30,300 --> 00:37:35,190

But as you know, broadcast and

corporate media starts to diminish

829

00:37:35,199 --> 00:37:38,160

even more, a lot of people are

going to have to be in these spaces.

830

00:37:38,550 --> 00:37:42,250

And I think the timing for me is

good because I kind of got in.

831

00:37:42,705 --> 00:37:45,885

You know, while it was still good

where you can still build an audience,

832

00:37:46,165 --> 00:37:48,925

um, there's a lot of competition

out there, but there's going to be a

833

00:37:48,925 --> 00:37:50,945

lot more competition in this Marcet.

834

00:37:51,275 --> 00:37:54,705

Um, I would say in about a

year or so, if not sooner,

835

00:37:54,864 --> 00:37:56,225

Marc Preston: I think it's,

I think it's wonderful.

836

00:37:56,225 --> 00:38:00,395

Uh, I think it's more democratized if

you will, uh, means of kind of putting

837

00:38:00,395 --> 00:38:02,915

something together and kind of letting

the Marcet decide, you know, the

838

00:38:02,915 --> 00:38:04,585

people, do they like it or do they not?

839

00:38:04,655 --> 00:38:07,705

I remember coming up and I was

studying broadcast journalism.

840

00:38:08,205 --> 00:38:12,095

I remember the journalism department,

uh, the news department, uh, was

841

00:38:12,105 --> 00:38:13,595

kind of a loss leader for a network.

842

00:38:13,615 --> 00:38:16,335

They weren't looking at it as a

big revenue kind of operation.

843

00:38:16,654 --> 00:38:18,055

Do you think there was a shift?

844

00:38:18,355 --> 00:38:18,655

Yep.

845

00:38:18,944 --> 00:38:22,335

Uh, and that shift kind of

changed the game quite a bit.

846

00:38:22,335 --> 00:38:23,525

I mean, what are your thoughts on that?

847

00:38:23,740 --> 00:38:25,010

We talked about that and I

848

00:38:25,010 --> 00:38:28,320

Don Lemon: forget, we talked

about that, uh, at dinner recently

849

00:38:28,320 --> 00:38:30,140

about what the shift was in.

850

00:38:30,150 --> 00:38:36,729

And some people say when it was, the shift

was kind of cable news helped that because

851

00:38:37,010 --> 00:38:41,450

people could tune in 24 hours a day and,

you know, run your ads and it became sort

852

00:38:41,450 --> 00:38:45,360

of a profit center, but it was really,

I think they said, actually, actually.

853

00:38:45,465 --> 00:38:46,045

Scratch that.

854

00:38:46,045 --> 00:38:46,705

I take that back.

855

00:38:47,635 --> 00:38:52,395

Uh, it was when some of the

deregulation happened around media,

856

00:38:52,395 --> 00:38:54,645

and I believe that was Nixon, right?

857

00:38:54,845 --> 00:38:59,635

And then, um, and then news organizations

start to become profit driven.

858

00:39:00,335 --> 00:39:02,775

Marc Preston: Um, plus I think the

telecom deregulation, I think when

859

00:39:02,775 --> 00:39:07,285

Clinton was president, I think 94, I think

is kind of when, when, when basically

860

00:39:07,285 --> 00:39:11,025

you had all these big media companies

started swallowing up the smaller fish.

861

00:39:11,025 --> 00:39:11,365

Yeah.

862

00:39:11,815 --> 00:39:11,965

Don Lemon: Yeah.

863

00:39:12,275 --> 00:39:12,655

Yeah.

864

00:39:12,925 --> 00:39:13,945

You're right about that.

865

00:39:13,945 --> 00:39:16,465

So, you know, it was a couple

of different things and then

866

00:39:16,465 --> 00:39:18,025

people realized, oh, we can.

867

00:39:18,285 --> 00:39:22,565

So the other thing when I, which

was the cable part of it was that

868

00:39:22,565 --> 00:39:25,964

you people realize that you didn't

have to send reporters everywhere.

869

00:39:25,964 --> 00:39:29,435

You didn't have to, even though CNN did

a great job and they were doing that.

870

00:39:29,765 --> 00:39:35,400

You could just have a couple of people

sitting around a table Giving their

871

00:39:35,410 --> 00:39:40,540

opinions and talking about the news

rather than sending out reporters

872

00:39:40,540 --> 00:39:41,730

to do whatever, whatever, whatever.

873

00:39:42,070 --> 00:39:43,350

And it was cheap programming.

874

00:39:43,690 --> 00:39:45,610

And then they realized, wow,

we can make money from this.

875

00:39:45,630 --> 00:39:47,480

We can just keep doing it 24 hours a day.

876

00:39:47,630 --> 00:39:51,300

Marc Preston: You know, it's funny because

when I studied, uh, I'm going back.

877

00:39:51,340 --> 00:39:53,520

I mean, I, I didn't, I

mean, close to journalism.

878

00:39:53,520 --> 00:39:56,100

I got it a tiny bit of reporting,

but I was a news writer,

879

00:39:56,590 --> 00:39:57,880

uh, while I was in college.

880

00:39:58,390 --> 00:40:02,130

And I remember one of my professors

said something like, no matter how

881

00:40:02,130 --> 00:40:06,730

hard you try to be unbiased, you know,

you come from a place, you, you can

882

00:40:06,750 --> 00:40:09,360

do, put all your effort into not being

biased, but there's going to be some

883

00:40:09,370 --> 00:40:12,430

inherent bias kind of like going back

to, we talked about Anthony Bourdain.

884

00:40:12,430 --> 00:40:15,340

He said, you know, you

could travel to China.

885

00:40:15,595 --> 00:40:16,235

Constantly.

886

00:40:16,245 --> 00:40:18,345

And you're still never going to

understand the Eastern culture.

887

00:40:18,355 --> 00:40:21,045

You know, that's, you never

fully going to digest it.

888

00:40:21,145 --> 00:40:23,745

What things did you do personally?

889

00:40:23,775 --> 00:40:25,815

Uh, because I, I kind of

think it's far as cool.

890

00:40:25,815 --> 00:40:27,704

People say it's, things are

very biased or whatever.

891

00:40:27,704 --> 00:40:32,354

I like that's subjective, but what

things were you doing to kind of what,

892

00:40:32,354 --> 00:40:36,620

what little checks or questions Would

you ask yourself going, did I do this?

893

00:40:36,620 --> 00:40:39,210

Did I examine the, you know, to

make sure that you personally are

894

00:40:39,210 --> 00:40:41,090

being as unbiased as you can be?

895

00:40:41,410 --> 00:40:44,280

What, what discipline did you

develop for yourself to go here?

896

00:40:44,280 --> 00:40:46,980

I want to make sure I'm

clearly telling this story.

897

00:40:47,420 --> 00:40:47,699

Don Lemon: Okay.

898

00:40:47,699 --> 00:40:52,319

So the discipline I learned, I learned

from, um, working in local news, network

899

00:40:52,320 --> 00:40:56,539

news, um, broadcast network news and

cable news, and the rigors are very,

900

00:40:56,729 --> 00:40:59,870

that you have to go through the, the

hoops that you have to jump through

901

00:41:00,190 --> 00:41:01,819

in order to get things on the air.

902

00:41:02,140 --> 00:41:03,700

Um, in traditional media.

903

00:41:03,730 --> 00:41:07,850

I don't think that the average person

understands what that what that is and

904

00:41:07,850 --> 00:41:10,340

how how rigorous it is, especially at CNN.

905

00:41:10,340 --> 00:41:12,220

It was extremely rigorous.

906

00:41:12,550 --> 00:41:14,400

So that's still in my DNA.

907

00:41:14,570 --> 00:41:19,060

And I think also, you know, quite

frankly, Marc, I think it hinders

908

00:41:19,080 --> 00:41:23,580

me a little bit in this new, um,

independent Thing that I'm doing

909

00:41:23,830 --> 00:41:29,560

because people who have gained the most

success here, there are no controls.

910

00:41:30,060 --> 00:41:33,220

There are no levers of,

there's no editorial rigor, no

911

00:41:33,230 --> 00:41:34,680

editorial standards, nothing.

912

00:41:35,049 --> 00:41:39,249

It's just, you know, pedal

to the metal and your opinion

913

00:41:39,250 --> 00:41:40,479

or whatever doesn't matter.

914

00:41:40,479 --> 00:41:44,219

If you look at the most successful

people who are the most successful

915

00:41:44,229 --> 00:41:49,149

streamers, broadcasters, digital,

um, content creators, it's people

916

00:41:49,149 --> 00:41:50,829

who don't have to abide by facts.

917

00:41:51,415 --> 00:41:52,935

And it's, it's all opinion.

918

00:41:53,185 --> 00:41:56,425

So for me, I will say, you

know, I have to abide by facts.

919

00:41:56,425 --> 00:41:58,835

I know that's not true and

blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

920

00:41:58,865 --> 00:42:02,845

And you know, there are people who

are in this game who give me advice

921

00:42:02,845 --> 00:42:04,154

and they say, Don, you're too careful.

922

00:42:04,404 --> 00:42:08,484

And so, um, I, you know, I think

that I am too careful with that.

923

00:42:08,485 --> 00:42:09,724

It's just in my DNA.

924

00:42:09,745 --> 00:42:13,085

So I don't, it comes to me naturally

and innately that I'm not going to

925

00:42:13,315 --> 00:42:15,040

say something that is fictitious.

926

00:42:15,040 --> 00:42:15,990

I'm not gonna lie.

927

00:42:16,170 --> 00:42:17,200

I'm not gonna embellish.

928

00:42:17,230 --> 00:42:17,880

I can't do it.

929

00:42:18,030 --> 00:42:19,390

I can have a personality.

930

00:42:19,390 --> 00:42:20,110

Marc Preston (2): Uh,

931

00:42:20,110 --> 00:42:25,799

Don Lemon: you know, I can be a good

performer, but it's not in my DNA

932

00:42:25,799 --> 00:42:30,249

to lie or embellish and, um, or just

to do something that is reckless.

933

00:42:30,249 --> 00:42:34,599

But for this whole thing, which is, I

think is a problem, all the misinformation

934

00:42:34,679 --> 00:42:37,440

that we have, if you're looking at

social and whatever you don't, you

935

00:42:37,440 --> 00:42:39,580

can say and do whatever you want.

936

00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:43,130

And it doesn't matter if it's true or not.

937

00:42:43,160 --> 00:42:47,100

And those sadly are the most

successful people in independent

938

00:42:47,100 --> 00:42:47,370

Marc Preston: media.

939

00:42:47,580 --> 00:42:50,140

Do you only have to look

at Alex Jones going now?

940

00:42:50,150 --> 00:42:52,570

Who, every time I see

that I'd hear about him.

941

00:42:52,579 --> 00:42:53,780

I'm like, who's watching this?

942

00:42:54,369 --> 00:42:55,579

There's a whole segment of the world.

943

00:42:55,579 --> 00:42:58,050

I'm just not, Oh yeah, Oh, absolutely.

944

00:42:58,050 --> 00:42:58,479

There are,

945

00:42:58,950 --> 00:43:01,760

Don Lemon: you look at the, you just,

I know you saw the things recently

946

00:43:01,760 --> 00:43:06,220

with the streamers who, you know,

unwittingly they say we're being co opted.

947

00:43:06,435 --> 00:43:13,575

By, um, Russia, right to, to do to for

disinform to produce and distribute

948

00:43:13,895 --> 00:43:18,544

distance disinformation in their

content and to be positive about Russia,

949

00:43:18,545 --> 00:43:23,714

negative about Ukraine and to, um,

create a narrative about to confuse

950

00:43:23,714 --> 00:43:26,005

people in America about our politics.

951

00:43:26,435 --> 00:43:31,055

And they were the most, some of the most

successful streamers and influencers,

952

00:43:31,415 --> 00:43:33,485

uh, and the biggest platforms.

953

00:43:34,035 --> 00:43:34,725

In the country.

954

00:43:36,025 --> 00:43:39,545

Marc Preston: Do you, what, what

do you think precipitated that,

955

00:43:39,595 --> 00:43:41,995

uh, generally I understand it's the

internet being able to, everybody

956

00:43:41,995 --> 00:43:43,115

can, which I think is wonderful.

957

00:43:43,115 --> 00:43:46,355

Everybody can have a literal

and figurative voice out there,

958

00:43:46,435 --> 00:43:50,085

but happened where I grew up.

959

00:43:50,115 --> 00:43:53,644

I remember like Peter Jennings,

Tom Brokaw, uh, to Ted Koppel.

960

00:43:53,644 --> 00:43:57,035

I'm, I'm trying to remember the anchors

that watch, there wasn't a lot of.

961

00:43:57,940 --> 00:44:03,840

Color, if you will, it was, it was, it was

information and the, the shift happened

962

00:44:04,440 --> 00:44:07,160

and I don't think it's a bad thing,

but it seems like it really didn't stop

963

00:44:07,160 --> 00:44:10,170

happening and we really went, like you

said, to the far end where people are just

964

00:44:10,170 --> 00:44:13,069

saying anything they want, is there a.

965

00:44:13,365 --> 00:44:16,395

Way back from that that you see

that where do you think there's

966

00:44:16,395 --> 00:44:17,575

going to be an appetite from people?

967

00:44:17,575 --> 00:44:21,485

Like I want something a little bit more

Substantive, you know, and I don't want

968

00:44:21,485 --> 00:44:25,735

it as much opinion All right, I don't want

it as much BS for like a better way of

969

00:44:25,735 --> 00:44:29,875

putting it What is the way back to get you

know, as a guys like yourself that could

970

00:44:29,924 --> 00:44:33,795

do something independently, but still

maintain editorial standards I mean, how

971

00:44:33,795 --> 00:44:35,495

do you think we get back to that place of?

972

00:44:35,835 --> 00:44:37,555

The way we grew up, if you will.

973

00:44:37,975 --> 00:44:39,075

I don't think that's going to happen,

974

00:44:39,085 --> 00:44:39,355

Don Lemon: Marc.

975

00:44:39,515 --> 00:44:40,175

I really don't.

976

00:44:40,205 --> 00:44:46,155

I don't think that, look, you

know, people said, Oh man, this

977

00:44:46,155 --> 00:44:49,425

new TV medium, uh, radio is great.

978

00:44:49,435 --> 00:44:51,254

Why, why do we have to

go to TV or whatever?

979

00:44:51,585 --> 00:44:54,664

And then the TV folks now are sort

of in the thing or, you know, saying

980

00:44:54,665 --> 00:44:56,095

like, well, this TV thing is great.

981

00:44:56,115 --> 00:44:59,495

Why do we have to go into

streaming or, um, listen, uh,

982

00:44:59,495 --> 00:45:02,655

we've got a, uh, we've got vinyl.

983

00:45:03,605 --> 00:45:04,225

Records.

984

00:45:04,535 --> 00:45:06,045

Why are we going to these cassettes?

985

00:45:06,425 --> 00:45:09,215

Why are we going to these eight tracks

and the eight tracks become cassettes and

986

00:45:09,215 --> 00:45:14,064

the cassettes become CDs and now it's all,

you know, you just click a button and you

987

00:45:14,075 --> 00:45:15,885

have it, whatever music that you want.

988

00:45:16,094 --> 00:45:17,075

So we've evolved.

989

00:45:17,375 --> 00:45:21,425

Um, and I think the, the medium will

evolve and I think it's, I think it's

990

00:45:21,435 --> 00:45:23,424

actually going to get worse with AI.

991

00:45:24,035 --> 00:45:24,215

Yeah.

992

00:45:24,215 --> 00:45:30,065

Oh, because what's real and what's not,

and the folks, sadly, many of the folks

993

00:45:30,065 --> 00:45:36,725

who are in control of other platforms,

whether it be social or, um, or digital

994

00:45:36,735 --> 00:45:41,955

or networks, um, they care about profits.

995

00:45:42,630 --> 00:45:47,870

And they care about, um, many of them

want to spread a certain narrative.

996

00:45:47,870 --> 00:45:53,579

The algorithms move people into silos and

sometimes it pushes them really far right.

997

00:45:53,580 --> 00:45:55,490

And sometimes it pushes

them really far left.

998

00:45:55,870 --> 00:45:58,989

And unless we get some sort of

regulation and some sort of shared

999

00:45:58,990 --> 00:46:02,940

consensus on what is real and what is

not, and that we have to put factual

00:46:02,940 --> 00:46:06,490

information out there, then I think

it's just, it's only going to get worse.

00:46:06,510 --> 00:46:09,810

I don't, I don't see us going, coming,

you know, recovering from this.

00:46:09,850 --> 00:46:10,530

Sorry.

00:46:10,530 --> 00:46:11,660

I don't know if that's.

00:46:11,810 --> 00:46:13,149

I

00:46:13,150 --> 00:46:15,350

Marc Preston: think that's exactly

why I wanted your opinion on that.

00:46:15,350 --> 00:46:19,140

Cause it is something that for, for

millennials, for my kids age, they

00:46:19,140 --> 00:46:22,690

don't remember an era where you can kick

on the TV at, you know, uh, five, six

00:46:22,900 --> 00:46:27,019

and 10, and you're going to be getting

pretty much facts uncolored if you will.

00:46:27,060 --> 00:46:28,900

And of course things evolve.

00:46:28,900 --> 00:46:32,060

I mean, how could it not exponentially,

you know, with everybody having

00:46:32,060 --> 00:46:35,830

a phone in their pocket, uh, but

do you find, do you see yourself?

00:46:35,985 --> 00:46:40,315

Uh, craving getting back into broadcast

news in the traditional sense, or do

00:46:40,315 --> 00:46:44,195

you think that this frontier is one that

really needs more exploration for you?

00:46:44,444 --> 00:46:45,295

Gosh, I don't know.

00:46:45,295 --> 00:46:47,154

Don Lemon: I mean, I didn't,

I never thought that I would

00:46:47,165 --> 00:46:48,535

be on cable news, right?

00:46:48,585 --> 00:46:51,325

I never, it was never my

goal to be on cable news.

00:46:51,335 --> 00:46:54,605

Like I said, I want it to be, you

know, Brian Gumbel or Peter Jennings,

00:46:54,605 --> 00:46:56,015

which is a network news anchor.

00:46:56,015 --> 00:47:00,775

And you know, I got to the network and,

uh, and then moved out and then came back.

00:47:00,775 --> 00:47:02,864

But, um, uh,

00:47:02,865 --> 00:47:08,965

Marc Preston: uh, You know, I know they

say man plans, God laughs, but I mean, you

00:47:08,965 --> 00:47:13,015

Don Lemon: know, look, I would never

say never about, you know, it depends

00:47:13,015 --> 00:47:16,685

on if someone offered me something

that was great or if I felt that was

00:47:16,685 --> 00:47:20,484

a great opportunity to be able to

practice my craft and to be able to

00:47:20,484 --> 00:47:22,165

inform people, then I would do it.

00:47:22,484 --> 00:47:26,605

I don't have to, I don't have the

same sort of ambition that I had,

00:47:26,605 --> 00:47:27,945

like I had to get to a certain level.

00:47:28,155 --> 00:47:28,765

I've gotten.

00:47:29,010 --> 00:47:30,510

To the top of this profession.

00:47:30,760 --> 00:47:35,920

And so now for me, my priorities have

changed and, and my priorities now are

00:47:35,920 --> 00:47:38,730

just, my priority is to, to inform people.

00:47:39,229 --> 00:47:44,710

And, uh, I realized that, you know,

you can, you can be in at any part

00:47:44,710 --> 00:47:48,210

or any level of this business, and

it's still sort of the same crap, as

00:47:48,210 --> 00:47:52,180

long as you're practicing and you're

doing the same thing, it feels good.

00:47:52,475 --> 00:47:55,325

You know, I don't feel different

when I'm sitting here talking, you

00:47:55,325 --> 00:47:58,405

know, doing my digital show in my

studio than I did when I was at CNN.

00:47:58,445 --> 00:48:02,475

I mean, it was a much bigger, shinier

facility with a bigger infrastructure,

00:48:02,735 --> 00:48:03,745

but it's still the same thing.

00:48:03,745 --> 00:48:04,725

It's still the same camera.

00:48:04,725 --> 00:48:04,984

Yeah.

00:48:04,985 --> 00:48:05,295

Yeah.

00:48:05,365 --> 00:48:06,894

Marc Preston: COVID is kind of a, uh,

00:48:06,945 --> 00:48:07,934

Don Lemon: training ground a little bit.

00:48:08,474 --> 00:48:08,814

Right.

00:48:08,814 --> 00:48:11,864

It prepared us for, for

people to be more relaxed.

00:48:12,134 --> 00:48:15,854

Um, and people started watching

people in their homes, bringing

00:48:15,854 --> 00:48:18,654

the news to their homes and

they're like, okay, well that's it.

00:48:18,834 --> 00:48:19,754

Now it's normalized.

00:48:19,774 --> 00:48:20,094

No one cares.

00:48:20,225 --> 00:48:22,064

I could give the news right here.

00:48:22,625 --> 00:48:25,315

And I, which I do, um,

this is my home studio.

00:48:25,315 --> 00:48:28,025

This is not my, this is not

my big, I have a big studio,

00:48:28,025 --> 00:48:29,805

which is really nice and grand.

00:48:30,275 --> 00:48:31,825

Um, but I can do it from here.

00:48:31,825 --> 00:48:32,385

Nobody cares.

00:48:32,385 --> 00:48:36,324

As a matter of fact, I do a five o'clock

show every day that I didn't plan on

00:48:36,335 --> 00:48:40,975

doing because I wanted to talk to my

subscribers and grow my own community.

00:48:40,984 --> 00:48:44,670

And I said, well, You know, this feels

weird because I'm doing sort of similar

00:48:44,670 --> 00:48:47,140

to what I was doing on CNN and I don't

really have a connection with the

00:48:47,140 --> 00:48:49,230

viewer and I have the opportunity now.

00:48:49,230 --> 00:48:51,789

So what I'm going to do, I'm going

to go live at five every day, a

00:48:51,790 --> 00:48:54,879

show where I talk to my subscribers

and we talk about what they

00:48:54,880 --> 00:48:56,039

what's what they're interested in.

00:48:56,040 --> 00:48:57,360

We read their comments and whatever.

00:48:57,779 --> 00:49:00,270

And I said, I'm just going to do

it, try it from my living room.

00:49:00,319 --> 00:49:00,799

And I did.

00:49:00,799 --> 00:49:01,499

And they loved it.

00:49:01,500 --> 00:49:03,760

And then I, so I put a

survey as like, look, yeah.

00:49:04,145 --> 00:49:07,955

I spent all this money on a

studio where you guys do it from.

00:49:07,955 --> 00:49:08,995

And they're like, do it from your house.

00:49:09,025 --> 00:49:11,295

We like you from your house,

Don, do it from your house.

00:49:11,585 --> 00:49:17,045

And so all of the, you know, sort of

the mechanics and, um, the, the, uh,

00:49:17,654 --> 00:49:20,445

what do you call them, the trappings?

00:49:20,445 --> 00:49:26,290

Oh, And the formality of the networks,

I think, is kind of young people

00:49:26,290 --> 00:49:27,370

don't want or care about that.

00:49:27,800 --> 00:49:29,260

Marc Preston: Yeah, I think

it's dissipating a little bit.

00:49:29,310 --> 00:49:31,850

You remember any time you're doing,

I mean, you know, when you're doing

00:49:31,850 --> 00:49:34,619

an interview, be somebody in politics

or anybody, they're gonna have

00:49:34,620 --> 00:49:37,280

to go to their local TV station,

set up a satellite feed and come.

00:49:37,670 --> 00:49:38,319

Now it's like.

00:49:38,530 --> 00:49:39,290

Oh, just stay at home.

00:49:39,290 --> 00:49:40,370

Kick on whatever.

00:49:40,410 --> 00:49:41,230

Isn't that?

00:49:41,270 --> 00:49:42,410

Yeah, your phone.

00:49:42,460 --> 00:49:46,200

And it's so funny because now we'll

go back to your former network.

00:49:46,200 --> 00:49:49,979

Anytime they interview somebody,

everybody, by the way, my favorite thing

00:49:49,979 --> 00:49:54,320

now is looking at how people set up their

camera shot, you know, what books they put

00:49:54,320 --> 00:49:56,710

in their shelves, you know, because you

know, they're thinking about it, you know,

00:49:56,710 --> 00:49:58,395

it's like, Oh, What's the Rorschach here?

00:49:58,395 --> 00:49:59,475

How am I interpreting this?

00:49:59,855 --> 00:50:03,515

But to go to your book real quick, you

know, obviously based on the title,

00:50:03,985 --> 00:50:05,815

is there faith, is there religion?

00:50:05,825 --> 00:50:08,245

Is that something that is

a component part of this?

00:50:08,255 --> 00:50:11,935

So I don't mean to sound reductive,

but what's kind of the, just the

00:50:11,935 --> 00:50:15,235

impetus for this, you said that,

uh, George Floyd, uh, that kind of

00:50:15,245 --> 00:50:16,665

started the ball rolling for you.

00:50:16,885 --> 00:50:19,045

Don Lemon: Well, that started the

ball rolling for the first book.

00:50:19,115 --> 00:50:19,985

00:50:19,985 --> 00:50:20,155

Marc Preston: book.

00:50:20,185 --> 00:50:20,575

I'm sorry.

00:50:20,575 --> 00:50:20,895

I'm sorry.

00:50:20,895 --> 00:50:21,195

I'm sorry.

00:50:21,215 --> 00:50:21,355

Uh,

00:50:22,675 --> 00:50:24,455

Don Lemon: but this one also

happened out of that one.

00:50:24,455 --> 00:50:27,714

I was writing that one and you

know, we talked a lot about

00:50:27,715 --> 00:50:28,985

God and faith and that one.

00:50:28,994 --> 00:50:33,715

And then, um, you know, it's funny after

we, the, the paperback came out for that.

00:50:34,165 --> 00:50:37,025

And, um, I was on the phone

with my collaborator, and she

00:50:37,025 --> 00:50:38,355

said, You know, I have an idea.

00:50:38,355 --> 00:50:41,855

I think for your next book, and we both

sort of said religion at the same time.

00:50:42,395 --> 00:50:44,595

Um, and we're like, That's it.

00:50:44,974 --> 00:50:48,415

And so, um, I wanted to the

reason I wrote this book.

00:50:48,415 --> 00:50:52,854

It was supposed to be this book was

supposed to be a coda to this is the fire.

00:50:53,375 --> 00:50:57,370

And then, um, You know, I, I left

CNN and I put it down for a while.

00:50:57,370 --> 00:50:59,710

And then when I picked it back up,

it became a much different book.

00:51:00,280 --> 00:51:05,420

But this book is really about how my

love of God, my love of country really

00:51:05,420 --> 00:51:10,090

shaped me, uh, into the person that

I am today and helped me to fight

00:51:10,130 --> 00:51:14,789

against the, you know, toxic evangelical

teachings that sought to marginalize me.

00:51:15,219 --> 00:51:17,250

And so I wanted to talk

about, how did you grow up?

00:51:17,270 --> 00:51:17,900

Maybe in Texas,

00:51:19,255 --> 00:51:19,675

Marc Preston (2): Oh, Baptist.

00:51:19,675 --> 00:51:20,015

I grew up

00:51:20,915 --> 00:51:22,195

Don Lemon: going to a Catholic school.

00:51:22,205 --> 00:51:25,145

So there was lots of

God, lots of Bible study.

00:51:25,335 --> 00:51:28,455

So I would have a catechism during

the week at the Catholic school and

00:51:28,455 --> 00:51:29,915

mass on Friday at the Catholic school.

00:51:29,915 --> 00:51:33,834

And then on Sunday I would go to,

you know, uh, early morning church

00:51:33,835 --> 00:51:37,904

service at my Baptist missionary

Baptist church and my, um, in my

00:51:37,904 --> 00:51:39,735

hometown and then the evening as well.

00:51:40,515 --> 00:51:42,845

So there was a lot of God and Jesus in

00:51:42,845 --> 00:51:43,545

Marc Preston: Bible study.

00:51:43,595 --> 00:51:47,055

When I moved from Texas, everybody

was Southern Baptist where I was from.

00:51:47,055 --> 00:51:47,519

Okay.

00:51:47,670 --> 00:51:49,630

Go to New Orleans, everybody's

Catholic, you know?

00:51:49,630 --> 00:51:51,880

So it's kind of funny you said your

school in Louisiana, you're going to end

00:51:51,880 --> 00:51:53,440

up at a Catholic school at least once.

00:51:53,480 --> 00:51:55,610

But for you, what was

that experience like?

00:51:55,610 --> 00:51:59,490

Cause of course you, I think publicly,

and I don't know where I read this,

00:51:59,730 --> 00:52:01,079

please correct me if I'm wrong.

00:52:01,110 --> 00:52:04,629

Um, you didn't come out as being

gay until far into your adulthood,

00:52:04,680 --> 00:52:06,270

you know, publicly, if you will.

00:52:06,909 --> 00:52:09,190

Growing up though, what

was it like though?

00:52:09,190 --> 00:52:10,640

I mean, growing in a Southern Baptist.

00:52:10,955 --> 00:52:13,175

You're, you know, you're

in Louisiana, red State.

00:52:14,025 --> 00:52:18,765

How was that for you being, you

kind of having your desires, goals,

00:52:18,765 --> 00:52:21,975

and aspirations in life and living

differently than people around you?

00:52:21,975 --> 00:52:22,785

What was that like?

00:52:22,965 --> 00:52:24,165

Don Lemon: No, I talk

about that in the book.

00:52:24,165 --> 00:52:27,525

It was, look, it was difficult

because, um, when you're a kid, you

00:52:27,525 --> 00:52:28,995

kind of have magical thinking, right?

00:52:28,995 --> 00:52:33,435

You know, that there's, um, I knew

what my sexuality was without even

00:52:33,435 --> 00:52:35,805

knowing about without it being sexual.

00:52:35,895 --> 00:52:35,985

Mm-Hmm.

00:52:36,225 --> 00:52:40,485

if you, you know, as I've known since

I, as long as I could remember, but, um.

00:52:41,315 --> 00:52:45,085

When you're a kid, and then when you

start to get a little bit older and you

00:52:45,095 --> 00:52:50,564

know what it is, but you can't quite put

your finger on it, you start to pray.

00:52:50,805 --> 00:52:54,605

So I started to pray like this, this

would go away, this sort of attraction

00:52:54,605 --> 00:52:58,225

that I had to, and crushes that I had

on my friends and that kind of things.

00:52:58,704 --> 00:53:00,445

Um, so you were, you were doubting

00:53:00,445 --> 00:53:01,525

Marc Preston: yourself in many ways.

00:53:01,665 --> 00:53:05,985

Was the religion aspect of things making

you think you were less than in some way?

00:53:05,985 --> 00:53:06,915

Um, Yeah, because

00:53:06,915 --> 00:53:10,055

Don Lemon: I was, you know, religion told

me that I was an abomination, at least

00:53:10,085 --> 00:53:13,365

the folks who were, who were, that's the

way that people were interpreting the

00:53:13,365 --> 00:53:19,005

scriptures, uh, which now I know it's

not what it is, um, that people interpret

00:53:19,005 --> 00:53:20,545

the scriptures in ways that they want to.

00:53:20,545 --> 00:53:24,665

But I was, I never, it was, I

thought I tried to pray the gay away.

00:53:25,090 --> 00:53:29,170

I remember sitting in the pews

just before I got baptized, praying

00:53:29,170 --> 00:53:30,570

that I would pray the gay way.

00:53:30,570 --> 00:53:30,850

Right.

00:53:31,080 --> 00:53:33,960

And I thought when you're a kid

or you're a young person, you

00:53:34,160 --> 00:53:35,450

believe in magical thinking.

00:53:35,450 --> 00:53:37,390

And look, we believe in Santa

Claus and the Easter bunny, you

00:53:37,390 --> 00:53:38,640

know, that sort of continued.

00:53:39,269 --> 00:53:43,275

Um, And so I would pray

and then it never happened.

00:53:43,385 --> 00:53:46,455

And then as I got older and I realized,

you know, a critical thinking, I'm like,

00:53:46,455 --> 00:53:47,395

well, that's never going to happen.

00:53:47,395 --> 00:53:48,455

This is just who I am.

00:53:48,795 --> 00:53:50,915

So that holding that

secret was very tough.

00:53:51,304 --> 00:53:56,354

And, um, you know, once I came out and

once, once I moved to New York and I

00:53:56,354 --> 00:54:02,670

came out, um, it was, Especially when I

came out in my first book in 2011 to the

00:54:02,670 --> 00:54:06,160

public, it was a weight and lifted off

of my shoulder and that's when I started

00:54:06,190 --> 00:54:12,139

to gain some sort of, um, I became self

possessed and I gained autonomy and I

00:54:12,139 --> 00:54:13,820

realized the power that I had as a human

00:54:13,820 --> 00:54:14,070

Marc Preston: being.

00:54:14,139 --> 00:54:17,440

It's unique in that, I don't mean to

keep going back to CNN, but of course

00:54:17,440 --> 00:54:22,710

you and Anderson Cooper are both

very high profile gay men in America.

00:54:23,220 --> 00:54:24,340

Did y'all ever have any power?

00:54:24,390 --> 00:54:26,720

I was like, Hey, what's

this experience like?

00:54:26,800 --> 00:54:26,990

No.

00:54:27,360 --> 00:54:27,490

So

00:54:27,540 --> 00:54:27,700

Don Lemon: as

00:54:27,770 --> 00:54:27,990

Marc Preston: I,

00:54:28,050 --> 00:54:31,680

Don Lemon: as I wrote in 2011, um,

when I came out in 2011, it was,

00:54:31,709 --> 00:54:33,289

I think Rachel Maddow was out.

00:54:33,300 --> 00:54:34,659

She was on MSNBC.

00:54:35,160 --> 00:54:39,139

Um, and, uh, not, she did not

have the profile that she has now.

00:54:39,139 --> 00:54:40,280

She did not have the success.

00:54:40,290 --> 00:54:40,999

She's very good.

00:54:41,159 --> 00:54:42,620

She was, it was, it was gaining.

00:54:42,620 --> 00:54:45,700

She was gaining momentum, but she wasn't

like Rachel Maddow like she is now.

00:54:45,700 --> 00:54:49,240

And then there was another

person who was at headline news.

00:54:49,750 --> 00:54:55,770

Um, Thomas Roberts, who was an anchor on

headline news and me, and that was it.

00:54:56,310 --> 00:54:58,170

And so there was no roadmap for me.

00:54:58,190 --> 00:55:01,710

There was no one I could really relate

to because I, for, you know, the, um,

00:55:01,710 --> 00:55:07,609

the rules are different for a black man.

00:55:08,035 --> 00:55:11,775

So I was a black man in an industry

that was basically a white industry,

00:55:12,155 --> 00:55:17,214

uh, and dealing with already, you

know, you know, having, you know,

00:55:17,225 --> 00:55:19,425

being a minority in the business.

00:55:19,855 --> 00:55:23,964

Uh, I was like, so I already, I had that

and hopefully, you know, I can survive.

00:55:23,964 --> 00:55:27,165

And one day someone will believe

that a black man can carry a show in

00:55:27,165 --> 00:55:28,855

primetime, which eventually did happen.

00:55:29,445 --> 00:55:30,775

Uh, and then I said, you know what?

00:55:30,805 --> 00:55:34,385

I have, I'm on this great trajectory

and I'm going to ruin it all.

00:55:34,565 --> 00:55:36,665

By just being honest about who I am.

00:55:37,385 --> 00:55:39,325

And so there was no pow wow.

00:55:39,355 --> 00:55:42,205

Uh, I didn't talk to Anderson

about Anderson was not out then.

00:55:42,205 --> 00:55:45,964

And I, I mean, he may have been resentful

for me even asking him about it.

00:55:45,975 --> 00:55:49,365

So I don't think that, um, so

there was, there wasn't that.

00:55:49,365 --> 00:55:51,434

And we just didn't have that

kind of a relationship, although

00:55:51,434 --> 00:55:52,574

they were, we were friendly.

00:55:52,905 --> 00:55:55,915

But the first person, honestly, to

like, send me flowers and congratulate

00:55:55,915 --> 00:55:59,195

me, one of them was Rachel Maddow and

the other one was Charles Barkley.

00:55:59,315 --> 00:56:00,075

As far as,

00:56:00,115 --> 00:56:02,815

Marc Preston: uh, how it

landed with your family.

00:56:02,870 --> 00:56:04,350

Were they cheering you on?

00:56:04,350 --> 00:56:05,560

Were they like, be careful?

00:56:05,560 --> 00:56:08,510

What was, what kind of feedback

were you getting from them?

00:56:08,560 --> 00:56:09,100

Well, I

00:56:09,230 --> 00:56:12,240

Don Lemon: had come out to my family

by then and they were, they were,

00:56:12,299 --> 00:56:16,049

they were basically whatever, we

will be supportive of whatever it is

00:56:16,049 --> 00:56:17,760

because we had already gone through.

00:56:19,205 --> 00:56:21,615

what it is that we

would have to do, right?

00:56:21,645 --> 00:56:25,845

What it is that they, if they had any

issues with me, uh, coming out or my

00:56:25,845 --> 00:56:27,825

sexuality, we had already dealt with that.

00:56:27,915 --> 00:56:29,095

We'd already gone through it.

00:56:29,455 --> 00:56:31,404

And so they were, they were

just at a point where they

00:56:31,405 --> 00:56:32,914

were very supportive of me.

00:56:33,085 --> 00:56:36,624

Uh, and, you know, I read the

book to my mom and we discussed it

00:56:36,624 --> 00:56:40,045

and, but always my mom and have,

have the best open relationship.

00:56:40,045 --> 00:56:43,695

So that wasn't a big deal, but it

was mostly support from my family now

00:56:43,695 --> 00:56:46,215

from the public, um, mostly support.

00:56:46,605 --> 00:56:52,525

Um, And, but also a lot of, you

know, uh, a lot of bigotry, a lot of

00:56:52,535 --> 00:56:57,734

homophobia, um, a lot of name calling

from, you know, people who are just

00:56:57,734 --> 00:57:01,925

not willing to have the reality that

gay people exist and should exist in

00:57:01,925 --> 00:57:03,595

this culture with all equal rights.

00:57:04,115 --> 00:57:06,725

And for people who say,

Oh, it's not a big deal.

00:57:07,235 --> 00:57:08,975

Uh, I think visibility is important.

00:57:09,555 --> 00:57:12,085

Because, um, you know, I don't know.

00:57:12,105 --> 00:57:14,645

I don't know necessarily if

people would have to come out now.

00:57:14,645 --> 00:57:18,405

I think we'll get to a day where it

doesn't matter, but I do think visibility

00:57:18,405 --> 00:57:21,084

is important and all those people who

are saying, well, I don't need to know.

00:57:21,085 --> 00:57:21,754

I don't need to know.

00:57:21,754 --> 00:57:23,745

And it's like, well, I don't need

to know that you're heterosexual,

00:57:23,745 --> 00:57:24,934

but you talk about your wife.

00:57:25,280 --> 00:57:28,520

You wear a wedding band, you

have your kids, you know,

00:57:28,520 --> 00:57:29,970

pictures near on your desk.

00:57:29,970 --> 00:57:32,980

And every day that signals to

me that you are a heterosexual

00:57:32,980 --> 00:57:34,509

person in a heterosexual marriage.

00:57:34,799 --> 00:57:40,190

And so why can't I be just as, um,

open and candid about who I am?

00:57:40,420 --> 00:57:42,410

And so I don't assume when

people say, I don't need to know

00:57:42,410 --> 00:57:43,450

what you do in your bedroom.

00:57:43,770 --> 00:57:45,990

It's like, well, he was a

straight person and I see you.

00:57:45,990 --> 00:57:50,810

I don't even think about what you do

because I say that i'm married to a

00:57:50,810 --> 00:57:51,949

man or in a relationship with that.

00:57:51,950 --> 00:57:55,470

You automatically assume that you have to

think about what I do in my bedroom That

00:57:55,470 --> 00:57:57,089

says more about you than it does about me.

00:57:57,220 --> 00:57:59,179

Marc Preston: Yeah, like it's all

I told me because i'd rather you

00:57:59,180 --> 00:58:05,900

know a happy world is is hopefully

uh, Safer, more chill world.

00:58:05,900 --> 00:58:08,490

And if people are doing what they

want to do without, or being able

00:58:08,490 --> 00:58:12,470

to express themselves in a way which

brings them joy without any grief,

00:58:12,500 --> 00:58:14,470

that's, uh, you know, that's optimal.

00:58:14,470 --> 00:58:17,590

And that's, that's, you know, of

course I'm an, an eternal optimist

00:58:17,590 --> 00:58:20,519

when it comes to that, you know,

think people are all inherently good.

00:58:20,520 --> 00:58:22,420

They just need to kind of learn

a little bit more, you know.

00:58:23,500 --> 00:58:28,810

Who do you think right now when you

are looking for commentary, when you

00:58:28,810 --> 00:58:32,590

are looking for insight, uh, that's,

it's intelligent, that makes sense.

00:58:32,630 --> 00:58:37,219

Who are you looking to, uh, kind of

in your mutual admiration society,

00:58:37,220 --> 00:58:39,489

kind of who's out there that you're

paying attention to right now?

00:58:40,340 --> 00:58:43,830

Don Lemon: Well, you know, I look,

um, I love Nicholas Kristoff.

00:58:43,830 --> 00:58:44,460

That's a different thing.

00:58:44,460 --> 00:58:47,240

If you're asking me about

people who are in broadcast.

00:58:47,660 --> 00:58:50,600

Um, I respect all of my

colleagues over at CNN.

00:58:51,080 --> 00:58:59,099

Um, I, I kind of admire, um,

what Rachel Maddow has done.

00:58:59,100 --> 00:59:03,300

If you're talking about broadcast cable

news figures, I admire what Rachel has

00:59:03,300 --> 00:59:08,025

done by By sort of reinventing herself

and what she's doing, she's still doing

00:59:08,025 --> 00:59:11,115

her show, but then she's branching out

and doing other things in the business

00:59:11,115 --> 00:59:12,575

and informing people in other ways.

00:59:12,575 --> 00:59:17,194

And rather than just on a daily, um, or

a nightly newscast, I mean, she's doing

00:59:17,205 --> 00:59:19,305

documentaries and books and whatever.

00:59:19,755 --> 00:59:22,304

Um, so I respect that.

00:59:22,745 --> 00:59:28,981

Um, I, you know, you know, I

respect folks like Judy Woodruff.

00:59:30,490 --> 00:59:34,170

And that kind of, and those

sorts of folks, but, uh, I'm

00:59:34,170 --> 00:59:37,970

not that sort of traditional old

school model of the news is not

00:59:37,980 --> 00:59:41,620

necessarily attractive to me anymore.

00:59:42,310 --> 00:59:44,639

Um, so, you know, that's really about it.

00:59:44,640 --> 00:59:47,740

And you know, quite frankly, my,

one of my favorite shows to watch

00:59:47,740 --> 00:59:49,699

in the morning is morning Joe.

00:59:49,699 --> 00:59:54,070

And I know that is a very opinionated

a point of view, but that's what I want

00:59:54,080 --> 00:59:58,770

in the morning and I want to, you know,

give it to me straight, no chaser.

00:59:59,295 --> 00:59:59,665

Marc Preston: And,

00:59:59,685 --> 01:00:00,075

Don Lemon: uh, I

01:00:00,075 --> 01:00:03,785

Marc Preston: like that one thing

I was curious about in terms of how

01:00:03,795 --> 01:00:07,385

news has changed, not really news,

but culture sociologically to be

01:00:07,385 --> 01:00:11,025

called out by the president, the

leader of the free world, and to be.

01:00:11,330 --> 01:00:12,230

Called out by name.

01:00:12,240 --> 01:00:12,670

How was it?

01:00:12,690 --> 01:00:14,620

Was that disorienting for you?

01:00:14,870 --> 01:00:19,200

Didn't Trump at one point in time, didn't

he bring you up and criticize and It's

01:00:19,200 --> 01:00:19,969

sort of like More than at one point.

01:00:20,670 --> 01:00:21,355

A couple of times.

01:00:21,355 --> 01:00:24,160

Didn't it feel like, it's like,

wait, there's a lot of delineation.

01:00:24,160 --> 01:00:27,320

You're not really supposed to

comment on us and we've got to judge,

01:00:27,439 --> 01:00:28,900

but what was, what was that like?

01:00:28,980 --> 01:00:30,259

Was your response pretty quick?

01:00:30,259 --> 01:00:32,790

Like, I know how I'm going to respond

or were you just had to take a moment

01:00:32,800 --> 01:00:34,310

with yourself to figure it all out?

01:00:34,520 --> 01:00:36,750

Don Lemon: Well, most of the

time I was not aware of it.

01:00:36,810 --> 01:00:38,190

Other people had to make me aware.

01:00:38,190 --> 01:00:40,890

Like, I would get texts

saying, Oh my gosh, I'm sorry,

01:00:40,920 --> 01:00:42,360

but this guy is such a jerk.

01:00:42,360 --> 01:00:43,469

Or they didn't use that word.

01:00:43,469 --> 01:00:44,380

They use a different word.

01:00:45,030 --> 01:00:47,360

Um, you know, it goes with a donkey.

01:00:47,719 --> 01:00:50,150

And so I would say, why,

who are you talking about?

01:00:50,150 --> 01:00:51,240

And they said, Oh, the president.

01:00:51,240 --> 01:00:53,039

And I'm like, I have no idea

what you're talking about.

01:00:53,039 --> 01:00:55,749

Cause I, I stopped following him

on Twitter and on social media

01:00:56,019 --> 01:00:56,999

because I had to cover him.

01:00:56,999 --> 01:00:59,389

And I'm like, I'm already going to know

what he said and what I have to cover.

01:00:59,389 --> 01:01:01,609

So why do I have It's

just anxiety inducing.

01:01:03,760 --> 01:01:07,350

And so, um, you know, they, they

would send it to me and I go, you

01:01:07,350 --> 01:01:08,420

know, I really don't want to know.

01:01:08,420 --> 01:01:10,450

I don't, I didn't, so

it didn't matter to me.

01:01:10,450 --> 01:01:16,879

I didn't care about him actually saying

it because I think he was, um, he, it

01:01:16,880 --> 01:01:21,860

was kind of embarrassing that he, Um,

even knew who I was as the president of

01:01:21,870 --> 01:01:24,800

the United States, that he really cared

what a cable news anchor was doing.

01:01:24,820 --> 01:01:26,750

It was just shocking, stunning to me.

01:01:27,410 --> 01:01:30,779

But the other part that was

the, the concerning part was

01:01:30,779 --> 01:01:32,590

that it put my life in danger.

01:01:32,699 --> 01:01:34,249

It put my family in danger.

01:01:34,420 --> 01:01:36,150

I get death threats.

01:01:36,540 --> 01:01:39,380

Um, I couldn't take the

subway anymore at times.

01:01:39,380 --> 01:01:40,560

I could not go out in public.

01:01:40,560 --> 01:01:44,740

My mom had to occasionally have

the police in front of her house.

01:01:45,320 --> 01:01:47,760

People would call the station

and threatened to kill me

01:01:47,760 --> 01:01:48,929

or stabbed me in the neck.

01:01:48,930 --> 01:01:53,690

And so, you know, and then later,

collectively, We, you know, pipe bombs

01:01:53,690 --> 01:01:59,080

would just somehow, you know, mysteriously

should make their way or arrive at CNN.

01:01:59,560 --> 01:02:02,049

And so those, that's the

thing that bothered me.

01:02:02,050 --> 01:02:05,220

It wasn't really him, um,

saying things about me.

01:02:05,480 --> 01:02:07,200

I just found it embarrassing that he did.

01:02:14,200 --> 01:02:17,080

Marc Preston: As we wrap up here, I

do kind of a quick fire off of seven

01:02:17,080 --> 01:02:20,860

quick, just fun questions, uh, for you

to see the last bit of get to know you.

01:02:21,330 --> 01:02:23,580

You being from Louisiana, I

got to ask you, what is your

01:02:23,580 --> 01:02:25,370

favorite, uh, comfort food?

01:02:26,440 --> 01:02:34,559

Don Lemon: Oh, best day is like a

really, really good batch of crawfish,

01:02:34,580 --> 01:02:37,620

fresh crawfish right out of the boil.

01:02:38,000 --> 01:02:38,730

That's it.

01:02:39,369 --> 01:02:42,790

Marc Preston: Are you, are you a

potato, corn or sausage or do you

01:02:42,790 --> 01:02:45,930

know what, what parts of that boil

are you bringing along for the rider?

01:02:45,930 --> 01:02:46,660

Is it just crawfish?

01:02:46,660 --> 01:02:50,280

Don Lemon: Potatoes and corn are

good, but I'm straight up crawfish.

01:02:50,350 --> 01:02:52,359

I mean, I could, I prefer.

01:02:52,700 --> 01:02:53,350

I like both of them.

01:02:53,600 --> 01:02:55,620

I would say I prefer the

corn better than potato.

01:02:55,620 --> 01:02:59,570

But if you get a good, if you do

the potato just right, I'm all in.

01:02:59,860 --> 01:03:01,810

But mostly it's the crawfish for me.

01:03:02,299 --> 01:03:02,629

Marc Preston: Uh huh.

01:03:02,690 --> 01:03:02,990

Yeah.

01:03:03,049 --> 01:03:03,199

And

01:03:03,200 --> 01:03:05,490

Don Lemon: we're out of crawfish

season and I'm craving them now.

01:03:05,490 --> 01:03:05,710

So.

01:03:06,910 --> 01:03:07,060

Marc Preston: Yeah.

01:03:07,060 --> 01:03:11,050

I was talking to Andrew Zimmern, uh, once

he was talking about Dini's in Bucktown.

01:03:11,060 --> 01:03:13,780

Did you ever make your way

there, uh, in, in New Orleans?

01:03:13,780 --> 01:03:14,600

And, uh,

01:03:14,620 --> 01:03:18,810

Don Lemon: I know Dini's I've done

Dini's, uh, their chargrilled oysters.

01:03:18,930 --> 01:03:19,250

Marc Preston: Yeah.

01:03:19,310 --> 01:03:19,550

Yeah.

01:03:19,590 --> 01:03:20,350

Don Lemon: And yeah.

01:03:20,569 --> 01:03:20,829

Yeah.

01:03:21,239 --> 01:03:24,309

Marc Preston: Oh, they have something that

the barbecue shrimp that they basically,

01:03:24,310 --> 01:03:25,590

it's just a lot of pepper butter.

01:03:25,630 --> 01:03:26,170

Oh God.

01:03:26,180 --> 01:03:27,400

Now you can tell I haven't had lunch yet.

01:03:27,830 --> 01:03:31,805

Um, next question real quick is,

uh, Three people you're sitting

01:03:31,805 --> 01:03:35,685

down to talk story living or not Who

would be three people you would want

01:03:35,685 --> 01:03:37,595

to sit down and have coffee with?

01:03:38,445 --> 01:03:42,525

Don Lemon: Oh and people will say

besides Jesus So three people I want

01:03:42,525 --> 01:03:47,065

to sit down and have coffee with I

think one would be James Baldwin.

01:03:48,174 --> 01:03:50,434

The other would be

01:03:53,275 --> 01:03:54,365

Coretta Scott King,

01:03:54,915 --> 01:03:55,105

Marc Preston: okay,

01:03:56,165 --> 01:03:58,415

Don Lemon: and the other one would be

01:04:00,705 --> 01:04:06,390

I think about this Cause I get a third,

the third choice would be, let me think.

01:04:06,400 --> 01:04:09,480

Cause there are several names come

to mind, but I just want to make sure

01:04:09,480 --> 01:04:10,990

that I'm thinking about everyone.

01:04:12,050 --> 01:04:14,219

Uh, this is going to sound

really, really weird.

01:04:14,219 --> 01:04:14,629

Okay.

01:04:15,040 --> 01:04:17,100

So it would be James Baldwin.

01:04:17,530 --> 01:04:19,660

Coretta Scott King and Judy Garland.

01:04:21,760 --> 01:04:22,840

Marc Preston: I like those good combos.

01:04:22,850 --> 01:04:24,620

They make for like a fun conversation.

01:04:24,620 --> 01:04:27,970

Cause it'd just be, you'd want to enjoy

them talking with one another as well.

01:04:27,980 --> 01:04:30,089

You know, that'd be just

kind of a fun thing to watch.

01:04:30,450 --> 01:04:32,099

Um, one of the

01:04:32,099 --> 01:04:37,399

Don Lemon: most talented people

I thought to ever live, you

01:04:37,399 --> 01:04:38,379

know, entertainment wise.

01:04:38,490 --> 01:04:39,550

And that was Judy Garland.

01:04:40,010 --> 01:04:43,310

And then, um, Coretta Scott

King, who was married to Dr.

01:04:43,310 --> 01:04:43,640

King.

01:04:43,640 --> 01:04:48,060

And I would want her perspective

as a woman, because I think she was

01:04:48,250 --> 01:04:50,379

just as extraordinary as he was.

01:04:50,939 --> 01:04:54,939

And, uh, James Baldwin was not only,

he wasn't a brand, he was a fire

01:04:54,939 --> 01:04:56,600

brand and he was before his time.

01:04:56,600 --> 01:05:02,180

And, uh, he spoke out and wrote

on things, uh, and, and, um, push

01:05:02,220 --> 01:05:07,240

things into the consciousness that

many people who then, then most.

01:05:07,840 --> 01:05:10,610

Marc Preston: Yeah, I love seeing

his quotes pop up on social media.

01:05:10,620 --> 01:05:11,630

I'm a big meme fan.

01:05:11,640 --> 01:05:15,130

Every time I see a quote of his pop

up, I'm like, I identify with that.

01:05:15,140 --> 01:05:17,140

You know, I probably need

to sit down with a book.

01:05:17,140 --> 01:05:19,969

I actually really can't dive into

his material a little bit more.

01:05:20,000 --> 01:05:20,850

Uh, most certainly.

01:05:21,029 --> 01:05:24,320

I got a third question, which

is, this is the fun one.

01:05:24,449 --> 01:05:26,509

Who's your favorite

celebrity crush as a kid?

01:05:26,510 --> 01:05:29,065

Who was your first big celebrity crush?

01:05:29,065 --> 01:05:29,795

Oh, well,

01:05:29,795 --> 01:05:34,174

Don Lemon: it wasn't my only one,

but this is going to sound crazy.

01:05:34,174 --> 01:05:35,550

It was Tom Jones.

01:05:35,620 --> 01:05:38,375

Don Lemon (2): Okay.

01:05:38,375 --> 01:05:41,129

Okay.

01:05:41,130 --> 01:05:42,720

Don Lemon: I can see that my big crush.

01:05:42,720 --> 01:05:43,500

That was like a kid.

01:05:43,500 --> 01:05:43,819

I didn't know.

01:05:43,820 --> 01:05:45,810

I would like to see Tom Jones perform.

01:05:45,810 --> 01:05:48,259

And then later I realized that

when I was a little bit older,

01:05:48,259 --> 01:05:50,780

like, well, he is, he was actually

a handsome man when I was a kid.

01:05:51,000 --> 01:05:53,350

I don't think I realized that

it was a kid, but I was in

01:05:53,350 --> 01:05:54,559

love with Farrah Fawcett.

01:05:56,440 --> 01:05:57,790

Marc Preston: Everybody had that poster.

01:05:57,830 --> 01:05:59,640

That's an iconic

01:05:59,640 --> 01:06:01,109

Don Lemon: poster.

01:06:01,110 --> 01:06:04,000

And I was so heartbroken when

she left Charlie's angels.

01:06:04,030 --> 01:06:06,150

I mean, literally heartbroken.

01:06:06,240 --> 01:06:07,510

Marc Preston: That was a special era.

01:06:07,510 --> 01:06:10,310

I was catching some more stuff

and reruns by that point in time,

01:06:10,310 --> 01:06:11,769

but it's like, Oh yes, who's this?

01:06:12,219 --> 01:06:13,929

Um, of course you get a little bit older.

01:06:13,930 --> 01:06:17,560

You pay attention a little bit more,

but fourth of the seven is you're

01:06:17,560 --> 01:06:18,710

going to be living on an Island.

01:06:18,750 --> 01:06:19,580

Beautiful Island.

01:06:19,590 --> 01:06:20,310

It's a resort.

01:06:20,485 --> 01:06:23,955

It's exactly where you want to be for a

whole year, but they don't have internet.

01:06:24,275 --> 01:06:28,165

You got to bring one album, one

CD with you, and that's going

01:06:28,165 --> 01:06:31,094

to be your entertainment because

you can't stream anything.

01:06:31,365 --> 01:06:32,334

What would that album be?

01:06:32,334 --> 01:06:35,715

And what would that, uh, what

would that, uh, movie that DVD be?

01:06:36,205 --> 01:06:40,415

Don Lemon: So the movie DVD would

be all about Eve with Betty Davis.

01:06:40,795 --> 01:06:42,265

That shows you how gay I am.

01:06:42,685 --> 01:06:46,264

And the album would be Judy

Garland live at Carnegie hall.

01:06:46,764 --> 01:06:49,405

Marc Preston: Definition of a

perfect day stemmed a stern you

01:06:49,415 --> 01:06:50,735

from time you get up to go to bed.

01:06:50,735 --> 01:06:54,345

What are the component parts for you

to say, God, this was a good day.

01:06:54,624 --> 01:07:00,975

Don Lemon: Uh, there would be an ocean

or beach with beautiful, warm blue water.

01:07:01,525 --> 01:07:03,259

Um, there would be, you.

01:07:03,530 --> 01:07:07,010

Hopefully some sort of seafood,

shellfish, crawfish, shrimp,

01:07:07,010 --> 01:07:08,310

crab, something like that.

01:07:08,810 --> 01:07:14,600

Um, uh, with my partner and

my family there as well.

01:07:14,680 --> 01:07:15,930

And that's it for me now.

01:07:16,319 --> 01:07:18,890

Um, I also do love rainy days too.

01:07:18,939 --> 01:07:21,559

So I love rainy days with

the remote control and an old

01:07:21,559 --> 01:07:22,930

black and white movie too.

01:07:23,380 --> 01:07:23,980

Very nice.

01:07:24,350 --> 01:07:25,040

Oh, my dogs.

01:07:25,400 --> 01:07:26,130

Marc Preston: Don't forget my dogs.

01:07:26,180 --> 01:07:28,170

Well, what kind of, what kind of

dogs do you, I've heard him, but

01:07:28,170 --> 01:07:29,190

what kind of dogs do you have?

01:07:29,525 --> 01:07:31,205

Don Lemon: I have three dogs.

01:07:31,225 --> 01:07:34,165

I'm not exactly sure what they

are, but they're poodle ish.

01:07:34,165 --> 01:07:36,265

Poodle s because they're all rescues.

01:07:36,275 --> 01:07:37,395

They're adjacent.

01:07:37,455 --> 01:07:37,825

Marc Preston: Yeah.

01:07:37,925 --> 01:07:38,165

Don Lemon: Yeah.

01:07:38,165 --> 01:07:39,155

They're poodle adjacent.

01:07:39,185 --> 01:07:40,285

They're all rescues in there.

01:07:40,365 --> 01:07:42,284

Naughty, but lovable.

01:07:42,325 --> 01:07:44,485

Marc Preston: But that's, that's,

that's, you know, they should be.

01:07:44,485 --> 01:07:44,785

Yeah.

01:07:44,905 --> 01:07:46,464

I've got my little puppy.

01:07:46,464 --> 01:07:48,105

Who's surprisingly quiet right now.

01:07:48,474 --> 01:07:50,984

Um, now if you, next question, if

you weren't doing this for a living

01:07:50,984 --> 01:07:54,915

journalism, if this was not in the

cards, what could you see yourself doing

01:07:55,175 --> 01:07:56,935

that would bring you joy besides this?

01:07:57,615 --> 01:08:01,995

Don Lemon: Oh, well, I think other

than acting would be great if I

01:08:01,995 --> 01:08:08,094

could act in a movie and probably

being maybe a movie or a television.

01:08:09,320 --> 01:08:10,660

producer or director.

01:08:11,310 --> 01:08:14,250

Um, I would like to do that,

but that's a whole nother show.

01:08:14,490 --> 01:08:15,190

You know, that's what that

01:08:16,420 --> 01:08:19,069

Marc Preston: here you are

creating, you're creating books.

01:08:19,070 --> 01:08:21,750

Now, you never, you know, you

could take one, take the book,

01:08:21,750 --> 01:08:23,019

turn it into a screenplay.

01:08:23,019 --> 01:08:25,489

There's, you know, something else

you can, I think that would be

01:08:25,490 --> 01:08:27,100

a fantastic Oscar winning actor.

01:08:27,130 --> 01:08:27,690

I really do.

01:08:27,700 --> 01:08:27,870

Awesome.

01:08:27,890 --> 01:08:28,370

You never know.

01:08:28,390 --> 01:08:30,170

Maybe, maybe I should get into it.

01:08:30,440 --> 01:08:31,370

Now, last question.

01:08:31,370 --> 01:08:33,040

If you're going to jump in

that DeLorean, you're going to

01:08:33,050 --> 01:08:34,650

have a moment with yourself.

01:08:34,660 --> 01:08:37,090

You're going to go back in time,

16 years old, and you got a

01:08:37,380 --> 01:08:38,879

piece of advice for yourself.

01:08:39,040 --> 01:08:43,070

You're able to go back for a moment

and, and see 16 year old you and

01:08:43,070 --> 01:08:44,880

say, here, take this to heart.

01:08:45,060 --> 01:08:47,040

This is a piece of advice

that will serve you well.

01:08:47,470 --> 01:08:51,200

Don Lemon: I would say, don't worry about

what people think about you and go out.

01:08:51,230 --> 01:08:55,259

And if you really want to be the

ruler of the world, you can do it.

01:08:55,259 --> 01:08:56,199

There are no limits.

01:08:56,240 --> 01:09:00,340

I wish I had known that because we, uh,

we always second guess ourselves and we

01:09:00,340 --> 01:09:02,110

tend to care what people think about us.

01:09:02,530 --> 01:09:03,040

And.

01:09:03,480 --> 01:09:04,630

You know, I don't now.

01:09:04,660 --> 01:09:06,410

But the older I get, I really don't.

01:09:06,800 --> 01:09:11,230

And, um, you know, I think it's

your options are limitless.

01:09:11,459 --> 01:09:12,640

That's what I would say.

01:09:13,560 --> 01:09:15,350

You know, you spend more

time with your family.

01:09:15,640 --> 01:09:18,050

Marc Preston: You remind me of

one of my favorite Latin quotes

01:09:18,050 --> 01:09:23,130

is, I think it's, uh, uh, uh, VM

and Vinny, I'm out fasting him.

01:09:23,130 --> 01:09:27,730

I think it's, it's basically, I'll either

find a way or I'll make one, you know?

01:09:28,179 --> 01:09:30,519

Um, and I think you've done

a wonderful job of that.

01:09:30,519 --> 01:09:34,550

And, uh, you know, I wish you nothing

but the best, my friend, because this

01:09:34,550 --> 01:09:38,170

is, this has been a real pleasure to sit

down with you to, uh, hear the story.

01:09:38,440 --> 01:09:41,249

I once was lost my search

for God in America.

01:09:41,445 --> 01:09:42,075

Also, you can

01:09:42,495 --> 01:09:45,735

Don Lemon: tune into YouTube

to, uh, it's, um, youtube.

01:09:46,205 --> 01:09:47,315

com slash at.

01:09:47,715 --> 01:09:48,405

You know, the at

01:09:48,405 --> 01:09:48,815

Marc Preston: sign,

01:09:49,025 --> 01:09:49,315

Don Lemon: the Don

01:09:49,315 --> 01:09:49,695

Marc Preston: Lemon show.

01:09:50,235 --> 01:09:52,145

I'll put that up on the site that way.

01:09:52,145 --> 01:09:53,925

I have all your, all your socials.

01:09:54,235 --> 01:09:56,005

I sincerely appreciate your time.

01:09:56,015 --> 01:09:56,854

I know you're a busy guy.

01:09:57,015 --> 01:09:58,665

Uh, congratulations on the book.

01:09:58,734 --> 01:10:01,285

I've really enjoyed watching the

construction worker dangling.

01:10:01,354 --> 01:10:03,015

I don't know how many

floors up behind you.

01:10:03,905 --> 01:10:04,504

I don't know.

01:10:04,545 --> 01:10:06,694

I don't know if I could ever do

that job, but I'm sure he gets

01:10:06,694 --> 01:10:08,435

compensated well for it, you know,

01:10:09,715 --> 01:10:11,305

Don Lemon: seven and eight stories.

01:10:12,695 --> 01:10:13,575

66 floor.

01:10:13,605 --> 01:10:14,255

Can you imagine?

01:10:14,255 --> 01:10:15,165

Marc Preston: And people would do that.

01:10:16,505 --> 01:10:20,365

I get chills just thinking strangely

I can fly an airplane, but I do

01:10:20,365 --> 01:10:21,855

not like being really high up.

01:10:21,874 --> 01:10:26,554

And I, I know it's ironic, but, uh,

but, uh, well enjoy the, uh, the

01:10:26,555 --> 01:10:28,214

rest of, Hey, it's the weekend now.

01:10:28,214 --> 01:10:29,245

So enjoy your weekend.

01:10:29,505 --> 01:10:30,665

Thank you again for your time.

01:10:30,665 --> 01:10:33,105

And I wish you nothing but

the best luck, my friend.

01:10:33,205 --> 01:10:34,105

Don Lemon: Thank you as well.

01:10:35,965 --> 01:10:36,225

Marc Preston: Okay.

01:10:36,225 --> 01:10:36,615

There you go.

01:10:36,615 --> 01:10:37,315

Don Lemon.

01:10:37,475 --> 01:10:40,285

What a really informative,

intriguing chat.

01:10:40,295 --> 01:10:43,975

Really enjoy the opportunity to sit

down and learn a little bit more

01:10:43,995 --> 01:10:45,815

about his story, where he came from.

01:10:46,105 --> 01:10:50,675

Uh, the Don Lemon and we know from CNN,

what is next YouTube, the thing he's

01:10:50,675 --> 01:10:55,154

doing now, and of course, as we discussed,

he's an author, new book out right now.

01:10:55,184 --> 01:10:58,855

I once was lost my search

for God in America.

01:10:59,450 --> 01:11:02,800

It is available everywhere you

pick up books, uh, but as Don

01:11:02,800 --> 01:11:06,080

and I were discussing, go find a

local bookstore and pick it up.

01:11:06,340 --> 01:11:08,950

Always great to support local

bookstores when you can.

01:11:09,139 --> 01:11:13,750

Of course, he's got a show on YouTube

and on all the socials, but as of

01:11:13,750 --> 01:11:15,279

right now, no longer on Amazon.

01:11:15,280 --> 01:11:20,560

X Uh, as of the taping of the show, uh,

he was still on X and then last week

01:11:20,950 --> 01:11:23,770

he, uh, left, uh, like many people have.

01:11:23,830 --> 01:11:28,750

But you can go to story and craft

pod.com and you can find everywhere.

01:11:28,780 --> 01:11:32,440

Uh, Don is on the socials, blue

Sky, YouTube, everywhere else.

01:11:32,590 --> 01:11:36,220

In fact, you can find out about every

one of our guests that's been on.

01:11:36,570 --> 01:11:40,300

Uh, their story where you can find them on

social media, all that kind of good stuff.

01:11:40,370 --> 01:11:44,980

And of course, as always, please go grab

your podcast app, follow the show, get

01:11:45,000 --> 01:11:49,529

those notifications every time there

is a new episode, uh, leave a review.

01:11:49,560 --> 01:11:54,669

And of course you can also just, uh, like

an episode, you know, throw stars our way.

01:11:54,729 --> 01:11:55,869

That is fantastic.

01:11:55,940 --> 01:11:57,210

Tell you what I'm going

to get on out of here.

01:11:57,210 --> 01:12:00,390

I've got the, uh, puppy,

uh, Ranger underneath me.

01:12:00,450 --> 01:12:01,180

I say puppy.

01:12:01,365 --> 01:12:05,665

Little guy is like nine months

old and he is 60 pounds.

01:12:05,735 --> 01:12:06,435

It's insane.

01:12:06,785 --> 01:12:11,164

And of course I'm very elated now

because he actually walks up and